The Sixth Man Cometh: Warriors Trade for Jordan Crawford

Wow. Joe Lacob did his job. He’s shipped out Toney Douglas, getting Jordan Crawford and Marshon Brooks from the Boston Celtics in return. It was a three team deal, in which Douglas went to the Miami Heat, and the Heat sent Joel Anthony and some picks to the Celtics.

I’ve been after Lacob to get Stephen Curry a legitimate backup, and he did just that. He did better than that, in fact. In Jordan Crawford, he got the Warriors a legitimate Sixth Man to replace Jarrett Jack.

And by so doing, has turned the Golden State Warriors into legitimate contenders for the NBA title. 

JORDAN CRAWFORD

There has been some confusion in the Warriors media about who Jordan Crawford is, and the role that he will play for the Warriors. Marcus Thompson, for instance, seems to believe that he’s a shooting guard.

Wrong.

Jordan Crawford was brought to the Warriors to play POINT GUARD, behind Stephen Curry. It is Crawford who is going to be running the Warriors’ second unit, moving Kent Bazemore where he belongs, off the ball.

Before this season, Crawford was played almost exclusively at the two, and generated a bit of a bad reputation. Witness this summation from Grantland’s Robert Mays:

Notorious chucker who maintains one of the planet’s worst shot selections and misses a staggering amount of attempts; not pumped about the whole defense thing.

That was the old Jordan Crawford. But this season, a remarkable transformation has taken place. Celtics coach Brad Stevens turned Crawford into his starting point guard. Where Crawford absolutely flourished, and a team that was expected to tank made a surprising surge into the Eastern Conference playoff picture. Prompting Bill Simmons to write:

Anyone who can turn Jordan Crawford into a competent point guard has to be a Coach of the Year candidate.

And bemoan the fact of the Celtics’ resurgence. Simmons is completely behind Danny Ainge’s obvious desire to tank for a shot at Andrew Wiggins, Jabari Parker, et al.

Well, the Celtics clearly got their tank back on with this trade. I think we can assume Rondo is next, as soon as he proves he’s healthy.

Jordan Crawford has proved himself this season to be a lead guard, capable of running a team. To begin with, take a look at his 5.7 assists against only 2.2 turnovers, in 31 minutes/gm. That’s a terrific assist level on a bad team with no real finishers. And the assist/to ratio of 2.6 is also terrific. On a team that has been afflicted by the ballhandling woes of Bazemore and Douglas (not to mention the occasional Stephen Curry lapse), Crawford will appear a godsend.

Here’s my take on Crawford’s point guard abilities, beyond the stats:

Crawford’s handle is rock-solid. Unlike most NBA point guards, he goes left as well as he goes right, and can finish with either hand. He has terrific court vision, and is a great facilitator whose passes hit his targets on the hands.

He is terrific in the open court. Possesses great acceleration. Runs the break well (a notable Douglas and Bazemore bugaboo).

And, like Jarrett Jack, Crawford is terrific at creating his own shot. At 6-4″, he can simply shoot over most of his defenders. He has unlimited range on his three point shot, if not great accuracy (.318 this season). His bread and butter is the midrange shot, where he is extremely efficient. And while he’s not a high-flying finisher, he’s got the ability to break defenders down off the dribble and create penetration.

Take a look for yourself (to the strains of Tupac’s “Picture Me Rolling”):

Also like Jack, Crawford loves to take the big shot. Brad Stevens said of him: “He’s a tough shot maker… he’s not afraid of the moment.” And Tom Thibodeau said this of him:

He’s always been an explosive guy, a guy you’re concerned with when you come into the game. It doesn’t take much to get him going. And sometimes, even if he doesn’t have a good game going, if he knocks one or two shots down, he’ll get real hot real fast. He’s a guy that you always have to pay attention to.

In other words, Crawford’s not just the perfect guy to run the Warriors offense-starved second unit, but also a perfect guy to pair with Curry in the backcourt, to move Curry off the ball.

The Warriors have found their offensive replacement for Jarrett Jack. While adding Andre Iguodala, and losing no one else of importance on their roster. Not to mention remaining under the cap. A remarkable achievement, for which I heartily congratulate the Warriors’ GM, Joe Lacob.

There are a couple of concerns with Crawford: that “chucking” thing, and his defense. But I’m not really concerned with either.

To start with, Crawford earned his chucking reputation playing off the ball, on losing teams. He’s been a different player on the Celtics as a point guard, and I expect that to continue, and even improve, on the far better Warriors.

Partially as a result of his great free-throw shooting (career 82%) his TS% is a very respectable .526 this season. Last season Jarrett Jack’s was .542, but this season on the Cavs it’s down to .496.

As for his sub-par three point efficiency, I expect Mark Jackson to restrain that a bit. But I also wouldn’t be surprised if it improved considerably, ala Andre Iguodala’s. Getting the opportunity to play alongside Curry and Thompson, and even Barnes, Speights and Green, will create some great looks for Crawford, that he hasn’t gotten so far in his career.

As for his defense, the Warriors have obviously lost some of the ability to defend point guards that Toney Douglas gave them. But I don’t think they really needed that: Iggy, Thompson and Bazemore are all good defenders of point guards. Green and (gulp) Barnes will be given the better wings to guard. Crawford can and will be hidden on the least dangerous wing. And his size will probably make him a better defender of them than Jarrett Jack was.

I’m ecstatic over this deal. The Warriors have acquired their Sixth Man. Their Manu Ginobili, their Jamal Crawford, their Sarunas Marciulonis. Their Jarrett Jack.

NBA, en garde.

The Warriors are coming.

MARSHON BROOKS

I might be wrong about this, but I don’t think there’s anything to be intrigued with here. I think Brooks was just a throw in, and will be planted firmly on the Warriors bench behind Kent Bazemore. After a decent rookie season in which he got a lot of minutes playing for a very bad team, Brooks has virtually disappeared from view. Not a great shooter, terrible defender, no reason to play him. An expiring contract.

TONEY DOUGLAS ON THE HEAT

Most commentators seem to view the Heat’s side of this trade from a money angle. They dumped Joel Anthony’s larger contract, thus saving them considerable luxury tax, and also giving them flexibility to add another big man for the stretch run this season.

I think there’s a little more to it than that. The Heat have been shorthanded at guard this season, with Ray Allen more limited than ever, Dwayne Wade sitting out games to help his knee, and now Mario Chalmers dinged up. They’ve been shopping for a guard, and I think Douglas might just fit them perfectly. Great defender, as we know. Great three point shooting target for LeBron to find. And with LeBron, Chalmers and Cole handling the ballhandling duties, Douglas’ greatest weakness is covered up.

The Warriors needed more from Douglas than perhaps he could handle. In a different role, the Heat may get the best out of him. An underrated move for the Heat.

158 Responses to The Sixth Man Cometh: Warriors Trade for Jordan Crawford

  1. As with many of the Warriors players, it really is going to depend on how Mark Jackson utilizes him… is he going to say “be Monta, we need scoring” which will lead to a chuck-a-thon… or will he be the facilitator that Davis has cultivated this season?

    He’s a Nate Robinson type… he’ll be the hero sometimes and the goat the others. Hopefully the latter more than the former. I’m not sure I’m as fired up as you are, but I definitely think it’s a solid move that could pay off.

  2. I’m pretty pumped about this deal; the potential to get a legitimate scoring option off the bench, someone who can create, great FT shooter, and who has developed into a decent PG, with a very good handle; for Toney Douglas who was doing the Ws not much. Pretty nice job W’s front office!

  3. More optimistic about M. Brooks. Has the ability to get to the foul-line. Warriors need that. Also has very long arms and has some quickness. Believe he can defend.

  4. I agree this was a steel compared to what the Dubs had to surrender. I’m a fan of Jamal’s propensity to give instant offense. He’s streaky and could force the issue when he’s not hitting. With that said, that ability to drop 20 points in 20 minutes is exactly what your lead sub should be ale to do. If he can continue to show an ability to distribute, it will make life easier for the second unit by putting them in positions where their comfortable.

    On another note, just want to give a shout out to Myers who has shown an ability to wheel-and-deal. This deal probably doesn’t get made if a) Lacob wasn’t a minority owner of the Celtics who has a good relationship with Ainge, and b) Ainge liked Myers who recommended him to Lacob when he was looking for a new GM. This is a far cry from the old days where our GM would be looked at as someone to take advantage of.

    God speed Warriors.

    • jamal crawfor() who had a brief stay under Nelson in oaktown, went on to win the ‘sixth man’ award (as did sportsman of the year j.r.smith, to put the prize in context), now plays for the LA/sterlings. the team some woeyr fans fancy as an arch rival (my preference would be Hou). jordan crawford gets to have a ‘d’ until he establishes an incapacity.

    • You’re probably right here, and it looks like credit is due. It didn’t look like they were going to be able to pull something like this off.

  5. Or using the right too for that matter

  6. Did Jordan play combo point with Bradley for Boston, something like Curry and Ellis?

    That he played heavy minutes with Boston is a plus, and you guys talked me out of picking up old vets at a heavy price.

    IF: he can run the subs, play up tempo and half court, run the starters if Curry goes down or fill in for Iguodala, and he sticks around for a few years and can develop with the team—

    This is a good deal. All of which, however, remains to be seen.

    Brooks sounds redundant, as does Bazemore now. And they still have trade exceptions, or half of one, to play with. Hard to believe these players might not be trade pieces, along with the other expirings, that another deal might not yet be in the works.

  7. Denver—

    I’m thinking a player who can create his own shot and pass is a good idea. Do we see Crawford Friday?

    I also want to see the load taken off Steph so he can focus on his scoring, especially his shooting.

    One way to put a hot team on its heels is force them to play catch up.

  8. Don’t mean to down play Myers role in trade, but Miami wanted to dump Anthony’s salary and was not looking for equal value, and Boston wanted Anthony, the recipe’ for an unbalanced trade was there to be made.

    I don’t think that either Crawford or Brooks can be included in any trade for a year since they were just obtained. Am I right.

    Brooks is light-years ahead of Bazemore. Has huge upside. Saw him play in person his first year and he was a raw force. Glides to the rim.Has the potential to be better on defense than Thompson.

    Small ball went to down hard last night. Hickson was able to bat ball out to perimeter twice as Lee was the center. No surprise there. With JON and Ezeli return the Warriors will be posed to play mostly tall ball the rest of season.Even though the Warriors have been outscored with Ezeli on the court that should change with the Warriors now having more depth on their bench.

    Simply stupid to all Speights who was not shooting well to take 8 percent of all field goal attempts. Thompson 2-8 in second half. Hard to believe such was due to his being tired as he had a long rest between games.

    In my judgement, the Warriors are still one player away from being a truly complete team. Still have Barnes available to trade. Need defensive PF. Doubt the Warriors will make another trade, but sure hope so.

    Nice to see the Kings defeat the Timberwolves on their home court.

  9. After yesterday, it looks even more like the limiting factor on this year’s Warriors team is the coach.

    Need defensive stops, but play your stopper only 17 minutes? Play your WORST defender 31 minutes instead?

    That’s Coach Jackson, the friggin’ idiot. The reason this great bunch of talent has lost the majority of its games against winning teams this season.

    • Seriously. WTF does Draymond have to do to get some playing time?

      Jackson put Bazemore AND Speights in the game before Draymond in the first half.

      I just can’t comprehend what is going on there.

      • I don’t think it’s that big a deal who comes in first. I think it was as simple as Jackson wanting to get Iggy, Bogut and Curry off the court first, letting Thompson and Lee run with the second unit to get them going.

        What is a big deal is the overall minutes allocation, and who gets the Nellieball minutes in crunch time. Giving Barnes 31 minutes to Green’s 17, when Barnes was playing horribly on the defensive end, was a head scratcher. As was relying on Barnes rather than Green in crunch time. Usually those minutes go to Green.

        I’m guessing it was because of the extreme smallness of Denver’s lineup. With a 2 PG backcourt and Foye at SF and Chandler at PF, Jackson might have wanted to go with the smaller defender.

        Or it could be that he simply has no choice. There is no doubt that as head coach he is being tasked with the development of Joe Lacob’s signature draft choice – The Tank Baby. Benching him for DGreen could mean a quick ticket out of town.

      • Amazing. I just looked at the box score and was surprised to see Barnes was in the game 31 minutes. Once more, I wasn’t aware of his presence. Yes, he knocked down some shots. But if he isn’t a defensive force, he’s not much use to the club, especially when they stick him at the 3. Let Crawford come in and score and put Green in for defense. Unless Barnes makes some dramatic transformation, highly unlikely I suspect, he’s just going to drag the team down.

        For an owner and coach who preach defense, that has to be the test for Barnes, and his grades are not good. Given all the playing time he’s had, he should have learned much more by now. Look at what Green has done and learned, playing 10-15 minutes fewer per game the last season and a half.

  10. Curry’s shooting woes continue. He’s shot poorly in all but one of the last 15 games or so… by far the worst shooting slump of his career. And I don’t buy into the notion that the shots he’s been taking have been more difficult than usual. He’s playing off the ball a decent amount, taking the same shots he took last year, and missing (sometimes badly).

    We can talk about coaching and roster changes ad infinitum, but the truth is this team isn’t winning anything with Curry playing like this.

    • I think we’d be better off if everyone—including the coach and Steph himself—remember that his first and major talent is shooting. It was a large reason for the team’s success last season, and Curry was helped by Jack allowing him some rest and play off the ball. He can make some nifty drives, but he should show those to set up his shots, not vice versa.

      • I think they’ve been trying to play him off the ball more, especially in the last two games. It hasn’t helped. He’s been missing plenty of spot up shots, feet set and all. Actually looking back at some box scores he’s been shooting poorly (not THIS poorly, but still) ever since the preseason. It’s really puzzling. Maybe a shooting coach could spot a subtle difference in his shot, but I can’t. And I certainly agree it’s the foundation of his entire game. Curry with a 38% three ball just isn’t a superstar player, and the warriors need one if they hope to contend.

        • They’ve been playing him off the ball late in the game, no? When he might be tired. He played another 40m last night. Part of the solution would be getting him started shooting earlier in the game so he can get into a rhythm. I doubt it’s his form. He had an excellent coach (Dad) and nailed that down before college.

          “I don’t want Steph Curry or Monta Ellis to be Mark Jackson…. These two guys’ greatest strength is scoring the basketball.” – Mark Jackson, before he started coaching.

          • cosmicballoon

            Steph is tired. He isn’t smiling much anymore during games. Hopefully the Warriors can lock up a high seed and sit Curry down the stretch to get him ready for playoffs.

          • Steph has set the bar of our expectations so high I’m disappointed when his shots go in but hit the rim. He is also getting a ton of attention now nationwide, which has to be distracting.

  11. Other thoughts on the Denver game:

    That quick hook for Iggy in the first quarter means that he’s not really back yet. If you couldn’t already tell by his inability to match up against the Nuggets’ quicker smalls and make an impact on this game.

    Curry’s definitely in a big time shooting slump. It will be interesting to see how much the Warriors’ ability to rely on Crawford for offense will help this. I expect it to help a lot. The most likely explanation for the slump is exhaustion.

    Continuing this theme, despite all our quibbles (and I’m not done with that), this game was really a tale of two benches. A quick glance at the +/- in the boxscore will tell you that. This is a game that the Warriors would have won with an already integrated Crawford on their team. I think people will be astonished how quickly adding a point guard/sixth man of his caliber will transform the second unit from dysfunction to utility.

    More quibbling: Jackson has really been terrible tactically late in games this season. Last night the Warriors got a stretch of play with Lee matched up against Mozgov at center, and didn’t run PNR once. Lee would simply devastate Mozgov in PNR. Then Bogut was brought in, and bingo, Lee/Curry PNR with Bogut stinking up the lane. Resulting in Mozgov — now nominally covering Bogut — standing and waiting under the basket for Lee’s arrival. Fortunately, Lee drew a foul on the collision.

    I do believe Jackson was absolutely right to combat Denver’s smallball with Warriors smallball, and that unit brought the Warriors all the way back to take the lead. If it weren’t for Curry’s turnover, this game might have had a different outcome.

    And it might have had a different outcome if Mark Jackson hadn’t had a complete brainfart at the same time. With Hickson going to the line for the And one, with the Warriors down one, you don’t want to bring Bogut back in to rebound the free throw? You don’t want to bring Green in for Barnes? Especially with Hickson — a terrible FT shooter — at the line?

    Jackson repeated this mistake on the next possession, with the same result. He finally made a move to put Bogut in on the Nuggets third trip to the line. Provoking a gale of twitter laughter from me. The game was already over.

    Jackson has prided himself in the past on substituting for either offense or defense in crunchtime possessions. What happened in this game?

    • The play of the smaller but more active Denver front court was impressive, and quite frankly they gave both Lee and Bogut fits. With an effective backcourt last night, Denver was a handful.

      I regret not having a similar player on the bench, a sizable, active big (Green isn’t quite big enough). If we had picked up Hickson over Speights?

  12. The problem with Brooks is that I don’t see how he’ll get much playing time, unless they bench Bazemore and give him time in the blowouts. He might be a good trade piece, however, and may be on the way out. After the starters, the FO has been quite frugal, and I don’t completely fault them for that.

    After the starters, the team could use an upgrade at about every position. Backup center will depend on the health of Ezeli. ESPN said O’Neal is coming back in 2-3 weeks? First I’ve heard of his progress.

    They also need to start bringing along prospects, a backup PG, for example. I’m skeptical NN will do the job. And they need to accumulate trade pieces. I’m not sure they have any now, other than youknowwho.

  13. I was forced into a comment on Lauridsen’s site. There is something about utterly incompetent basketball analysis that sets my teeth on edge.

    Thus, feltbot.

  14. Moving on from Curry: What makes people think Bazemore can ever be an NBA player? I mean I don’t think the guy has the ball skills to be a rotation level SG, and they’ve been trying to play him at the point… I’m trying to think of a comparison for him… A homeless man’s Gerald Green with better cheer leading? Has great open court athleticism- good for a chasedown block every three games- but overall a minus even defensively due to excessive fouling. Completely agree with Feltbot about the absurdity of Crawford moving to the 2 and Bazmore continuing to “facilitate” off the bench (I guess he means for the other team?). Don’t know much about Brooks but it’s hard to imagine anyone being worse.

    • I just can’t see Jackson rolling with a Crawford/Brooks backcourt defensively. His head would explode.

      I was beyond impressed that Warriors management understood and acted on the need for an offense only player in Crawford. But I think there’s a definite limit in how far they’re willing to go in changing “the culture.”

      I also question how useful Brooks is as an offensive player. His strength is in the midgame, but while that is useful tool in a point guard, it’s actually a detriment in a two-guard. You need three point shooting and floor spreading from your wings.

      There’s a reason why Brooks is buried in obscurity.

      • In light of last night’s quintessential Bazemoring I’m gonna just concede everything you said about Brooks’ game (I know nothing about the guy anyway) and double down on my “hard to imagine anyone being worse” argument. I feel like if Brooks just avoids actively denying curry the ball he’ll live up to that.

  15. Felty, been a while, had to swing by here after I saw you post on the Break. I too am very excited about this move. They were interviewing Myers before the game and he made a great point. He said we have a lot of player who are very very good off the ball. On the ball however, they don’t have anyone outside of Curry and AI who truly excel in that role. Klay can do it, Barnes can do it, but that isn’t them at their best. Crawford is a guy who excels on the ball. He is comfortable handling and scoring and distributing. Now I would have preferred a pass first, true pg, who could be brought in to facilitate for both the first and second team, but from what I have seen, Crawford will do just fine.

    I was comparing Jack’s and Crawfords career numbers and they are eerily similar. Jack did a wonderful job starting for an injured, star pg, then came here and really found a nice niche as a shot taker/maker ball handler with moxie. The talent around him in GS elevated Jacks game and made him seem a lot better than he actually was. This is evidenced by the decline in his game when he moved on to Cleveland for the cash moneys. Crawford is going to have that same opportunity. I wonder if he has ever had the ball at the top of the key with shooters like Klay and Curry spreading the floor and guys like Bogut and Lee ready to run the pick and roll with him. I expect him to become a far more efficient player with us.

    I also really like the cut of this benches jib with Crawford running things. I think he enables guys like Barnes and Draymond to get easier buckets all while being a threat himself. By all accounts it looks like JON is a couple of weeks away, so we could potentially have a second unit of Crawford, Barnes, Draymond, Mo and JON. Not bad at all. If this bench can find some chemistry and hold/expand leads while they are in, it will make the entirety of the team better. Sum is greater than the total of the parts sort of deal.

    Alas, time will tell. I am curious though to see how Crawford does playing with his new running mates, my guess is, he is going to be a kid in a candystore after coming from such a talentless team.

    • +1 Excellent points all around, Gmoney.

      If my comment on Adam’s blog brought you over, I’ll have to do it more often! Your basketball insights would be very welcome here.

      • Well, I am a huge MJ fan, wanted him as our coach even before he was a candidate, and I can’t handle the rip jobs they do on him there all the time. I haven’t been that active and, quite frankly, after a loss that place is really hard to take. Too much negativity for my taste. Will definitely stop be here more often to contribute. A positive outlook is essential in life!

        But I think you may be off on the Brooks thing, I don’t see why he wouldn’t play ahead of Baze. Given how wide the gap is in where people think he fits in, it should be interesting to see just how he does.

  16. Welcome GMoney. Always enjoyed reading your comments.

    Felty, believe you are right on in speculating that Jackson is playing Barnes over Green because he is both Lacob’s and Myers guy, especially since Green is clearly a superior player. What did you say on Adam’s site?

    One can look at the trade as the Warriors giving up no one for both Crawford and Brooks. I say that because Douglas hardly played and when he did he rarely would shoot which is his strength.

    The Warriors are now going to be so much better both offensively and defensively in the backcourt with both Crawford and Brooks. If the Warriors run, the Warriors will steam roll teams, and Brooks 2 point shooting and getting to the foul line will negate his slightly average three point shooting.

    The Denver game was another high FG shooting by an opponent and must give us pause. Seeing them shoot 54% from the field for the game has repeatedly itself much too often by our opponents. And while Bogut should have played more, I believe the Warriors got torched with him playing as well. Teams shooting a high fg percentage against us must be addressed. We have address such in the back-court, but the front court remains to need shoring up. Until Speights is relegated to the bench or traded our defensive woes will continue. JON and Ezeli will help but we need a big back up PF to relieve Lee and join and JON in the front court. The Warriors have the assets to make a major deal and should do so. If they could obtain a player as good as Hickson, the Warriors will complete to go all the way. Having a strong defensive guy up front will also negate Thompson’s repeated offensive inconsistency.

    With Brooks now on the team, in my judgment, will kill Bazemore’s time on the court. He’s been given plenty of time to prove himself and has come up way short.

    • “And while Bogut should have played more, I believe the Warriors got torched with him playing as well.”

      Just curious, if Bogut was being torched in the game, what tells you he should have played more?

      Oh wait. Maybe it could work out OK if Bogut was the primary scoring threat. It might have helped Jackson establish the tone of the game, forcing Denver to substitute to defend against him instead of simply scoring against him. But it doesn’t seem that Bogut is actually comfortable in a lead-the-offense role, so I don’t think that would work out.

      “…we need a big back up PF to relieve Lee and join and JON in the front court.”

      On this team as currently constructed, Green plays that role now.

      Like any fan, I have biases. My bias is to play Green AMAP (as much as possible), at any position whatsoever. He plays an ugly game. He doesn’t even look like a bball player. But even in Jackson’s nonsensical rotations he almost always finishes the floor with a +, no matter where Jackson plugs him into the lineup.

      Green is a better 3 than Barnes, almost always a better 4 or 5 than Speights, almost always the team’s best defender at ALL positions, a better defender at 2 or 3 than today’s injured Iggy. He’s an ASTONISHINGLY GREAT STOPPER, and on O he’s one of the best teammates a feller could have.

      So, Frank, while I agree that it’s perfectly obvious now that Speights ain’t great, this Draymond fan wouldn’t replace Speights with another outside player. My 2nd team would be Green @ 4/5, Barnes (ugh, Mr. Warm Body, he’ll have to do until Lacob gets over him) @ 4, and Crawford/Brooks/Bazemore at the wings.

      Whatever it took to get Green on the floor AMAP.

  17. It was an odd deal. Whatever Brooks’ merit, it’s hard to believe the FO had any serious interest in another SG or plan to play him much, in fact he’ll probably go down to Santa Cruz. The bet was on Crawford. We have to assume they took him because that was the only way they could work the deal.

    But what that means is that the roster is now filled at 15, with several who won’t help the club now, if ever, that, barring future trades, they won’t be able to bring anyone up, even as a 10 day tryout or fill in. Let us hope something else is in the works.

    Did Boston, not seeing much potential in Brooks, do this to open roster spots for development now and in the future, maybe to keep experimenting with new players until they find someone who might work? They now have 13.

    Any chance Barnes played 31 minutes, up from previous games, because they were on national TV? If so, what might that mean?

    • I wouldn’t be surprised to see Brooks waived, or bought out, in the event the Warriors wanted to add another player.

      I’m very skeptical of the Warriors making another significant move before the deadline, though. I think this is the team they’ll end up going to war with. And although I appear to be a minority of one on this, even on my own blog, I think this team will prove to be the best in the West.

      • I’m skeptical they can make a major move, unless they trade Barnes or do the unthinkable. But I’ve been wrong here before, as you all know. I do think they should clean the roster up and look to the future and bring prospects up now. They’re stuck with Kuzmic and Ned next season, however, about whom I have my doubts. (And is Ned injured again?)

    • Wow, I just realized from this article that Crawford will be a RFA next year (makes sense, of course, he’s coming off his rookie deal) — meaning that the Warriors might be able to keep him for a $3.2m qualifying offer.

      That is an excellent price to keep a sixth man of his potential caliber. Makes me even more ecstatic about this deal.

      As does this thought, which I didn’t mention above: Should Iggy go down again for an extended time, I don’t think the Warriors will fall apart like before. Crawford can’t do the things Iggy can do defensively, but he can do more than enough offensively to step ably into the breach — AND lead the second unit.

      Home run for the Warriors. Incredible deal. Hold on to your seat belts, Warriors fans, we have lift off.

      • FeltbotsFakeGirlfriend

        +1

        I am 100% on board with you. If this team stays healthy they can get the #1 seed in the Western Conference and have a great shot at going to the NBA Finals. Plus 23 of the Warriors final 40 games are at home.

  18. ESPN also reporting that Brooks may be waived or traded.

    Like to see the Warriors try to trade for 76ers Spenser Hawes. He’s
    on the block.

    Hat: Bogut can’t be an offensive force unless the Warriors want to run more dive cuts for him to the hoop as this is basically his game. Defense is better with Bogut on court than with Lee playing center. Not likely that Hickson would have gotten two offensive tap outs in fourth quarter if Bogut in game.

    Green is ok, but we need an upgrade at the PF back-up position. Don’t you think that Hawes could do that. What’s wrong with a JON-Hawes second unit rather than a JON-Green tandem?

  19. Anyone know how soon Brooks can be used in another deal? Moto?

    It is quite possible that the Warriors could get another useful player for his expiring contract and the remaining trade exception.

    • Hard to believe they won’t try to make use of that trade exception before it expires, if they’re in a mood to wheel and deal, especially with playoffs now being a good bet. Without good trade pieces and good draft picks, they won’t have many options to change and improve the next few years.

      The NBA has been turned upside down. So many major teams of the past are rebuilding and there are few really dominant teams. There is a window here that will close before long.

    • the two conditions that impose a 60 day freeze on re-trading a player acquired in a trade are — the player was combined with (an)other player(s) in the deal, and his new team is over the salary cap (which is where GS put itself over the summer and gave it the exceptions used to sign douglas, o’neal, speights).

      considering the larger trade exception from UT swallowing jefferson’s contract was 11 m., in theory they have an asset there, plus about 3 m. they can still fit under the lux tax threshold. they could even go into lux tax if a real impact player is available — just winning eight playoff games compared to the six last spring would mean a good return on the investment.

      the same conditions for utilizing the trade exceptions apply — as outlined previously, since GS doesn’t possess usable draft picks to deal, which is the normal expedient in trade exception transactions, they’re even more dependent on getting involved in a multi team trade in which one or more of the parties needs to cut its budget and has draft picks to throw in. Mia had the picks, and both Bos and Mia lightened their contractual obligations in the douglas/crawford deal.

      • OK thanks. So I guess Brooks can’t be re-traded this season.

        I think he’s more likely to be waived than make the rotation.

  20. Felt, much appreciation here for your posting (in the last thread) of Meschery’s Principles:

    MESCHERY’S PRINCIPALS
    #1 All good jump shooters must be fouled hard on the first shot they attempt.
    #2 No player should make an easy layup. Contest everything in the paint.
    #3 Playing defense hurts. Suck it up and live with it.
    #4 When you fight over a screen, be sure the screener feels the effect of your effort. He’ll not be so eager to set the next screen.
    #5 NEVER give up on a defensive assignment.
    #6 Take every defensive assignment personally.

    They’re perfectly represented by Draymond Green.

    #1: SOP for Green in every game. He fouls within seconds of first entering the game, like clockwork.
    #2: Always.
    #3: Have you noticed? Green’s head and face have tons of scars this year. They didn’t last year.
    #4: I had to laugh in the SA game when DG came in to defend against Bellinelli. Splitter screened for Bellinelli. Draymond didn’t even try to go around Splitter the first time, he FLATTENED Splitter, STOMPED on him, and raised his hand even before the whistle blew.
    #5 What? You kiddin’ me?
    #6 DG is the 2nd most decorated bball player in Michigan history, after only Magic Johnson. He didn’t achieve that standing by scoring or stylin’ or whining to refs, he earned it with results. In the overall scheme of things, stopping a scorer convincingly is worth even just a little bit more than scoring yourself.

  21. I think there’s a very good W team that we’re going to see sometime this Spring. It will have an effective Crawford, JON and Ezeli.

    Glued to the bench, in this scenario, or out of the building entirely, will be Speights and Bazemore. When the astrology is just right, a rare event, Speights can score. Most of the time, his main contribution is boneheadism and a few boards. His first stint yesterday was typical. I don’t see why he gets minutes over which ever fan is seated closest to the W’s bench. Or Green at C — a problem sure, but as bad as Speights? I doubt it.

    Bazemore seems a little calmer on the floor. Fewer or less egregious boneheads. But, nothing gets done.

    The story last night, to me, wasn’t Curry or the lineups (well, maybe the lineups), but the use of Speights and Bazemore, producing the fastest movement of the score in the wrong direction.

    With Crawford and Brooks gluing Bazemore to the bench and JON available instead of Speights, this is going to be a very good team.

    • Gee, I don’t know, Rick. The Ws starting 5 came out running on O, but didn’t really achieve any separation. They weren’t stopping anything at all on D.

      Jackson simply did not come up with a defensive answer for Denver’s super-small, super-quick offense. Adding JON, Crawford and Brooks to his lineup wouldn’t have changed that defensive picture at all.

      Changing the defensive scheme might have. Jackson could have gone to a zone, for example, or subbed in Green immediately. Where Lee let Chandler perform like an All Star, Green handled him quite effectively.

      It’s the system. In his coaching matchup against Shaw last night, Jackson got stripped and spanked.

      • Here’s the thing though — the starters, except Klay, were all positive for the game.

        One way to look at it, is that Curry was +4 in a 7 point loss. He played all but 8.3 minutes. That means, in those 8.3 minutes that Curry sat, the team was -11. The biggest single share of that was the end of the first quarter. So, one may reasonably look to see what was going on at that time.

        Was Nate Robinson killing them? Well, no. He wasn’t playing. I think what killed them was a couple of boneheads by Speights and Bazemore’s inability to run the offense. He’s happy if his entry pass isn’t stolen.

        Nate played about 22 minutes. At the end of the first 20 of those minutes, the W’s had the lead.

        I understand that it’s never one thing and that I could have started this kind of analysis with somebody other than Curry. But, no matter where you begin, I think you end with the same result: “among other things, the bench sucked”.

        And, I don’t disagree, Hat, with your analysis. I think the game was there but for the coaching. My point is that if the bench was even mediocre, the game would not have been as close as it was.

        • Very good point. Yeah, the new guy(s) should help improve the bench.

          Unlike Felt, though, I’m not expecting to see it transformed. The biggest problem the bench crew has had is the lack of teamwork. The new guys will be playing under the same system.

  22. moto @20—

    So GS will have Brooks for the rest of the season, since trades for him are frozen for 60 days, past the trade deadline?

    Actually, the trade was more expensive than it first appeared, then. They picked up $3.4m in salary and only dropped $1.6m, Douglas’s contract. Plus they lost a roster spot to a player they probably won’t use.

    But it did keep them out of luxury tax? I’ve forgotten how much they had under the threshold.

    Trade exceptions allow you to trade even if you exceed the threshold, but don’t keep you out of luxury tax, right? And additional player will be expensive as well.

    Not a very flexible salary cap.

    • not even counting o’neal’s contract (and they might give him another season anyway, ’cause he’s very skilled and cheap), they now have two expiring contracts combining about 3 m. and they already have about the same margin under the lux tax limit. so in theory if they added a vet around the mid level exception 5-6 m., they could waive Brooks or Bazemore for the roster spot, and still not have to pay lux tax on July 1. they’ll have to pay the pro-rated portion (approx. .50) of Brooks’ salary, but they used a partial trade exception surpassing that amount, which would have just evaporated if not utilized. they’re not going to sweat about Brooks’ $600 k., or the $400 k. owed to bazemore if they waive him, for that matter.

      • I thought you said they picked up Bazemore’s contract. And after O’Neal, the only contract not guaranteed is Green’s (aside from Brooks). Can Brooks and Bazemore both be waived?

        • the contracts of bazemore and brooks go away after 30 June. any player can be waived, they still get paid when their contracts are guaranteed, and the $$ counts against the cap. (obviously for those two, nothing after June unless they’re re-signed). if they need a roster spot, they’re simply the most expendable. green has a team option for next season which they will certainly exercise, if they have not done so already.

  23. Just for the record, for those of you oohing and ahhing over Bogut’s drive and dunk last night, Lee drew the defender well out of the lane, leaving an open freeway. I’m not sure he didn’t draw two.

    • I was one of those oohing and ahhing. It’s great to see Bogut look to finish with authority on the pick and roll. That’s what is needed to break the Curry blitz.

      And that’s what was missing in last year’s playoffs.

  24. Brooks won’t be waived. From Myers comments it appears he still wants to make another deal. Hope he does.

    Guess we’ll some Curry-Crawford backcourt at times.

    With Iggy hurting the Warriors have no one in the starting line-up that individually in the starting line-up is very good. That was evident in our last game when virtually ever starter was torched. Never impressed with Douglas defense, so I look upon Crawford as hopefully an improvement and believe that Brooks is an upgrade given his length and quickness.

    The Warriors decided not trade for Lowry because they thought he would be bad in the locker room. That tells me that Barnes was probably included in the possible deal and was on the trading block. Glad to hear that.

    • He gets Draymond’s grade right. But Curry gets a C? Hmm.

    • “A toe injury and shifting between starting and sixth-man roles have confused [Barnes] and kept him from being among the most talented people on the floor every night.”

      Even Simmons couldn’t overlook Barnes’ lack of production, but blaming Barnes’ “confusion” on his playing time is simply dishonest.

      One of the most talented people on the floor? In what basketball league might that be true?

      • That’s the thing that most baffles me about Barnes and his fans. They perceive some crazy level of talent/potential that just isn’t based on anything one can actually see on a basketball court. He jumps high. As far as I can tell, that’s his only real stand-out talent. Problem is he has no touch, no feel for the game, no motor, and no heart. He’s not nearly talented enough to make up for those deficiencies.

    • Bogut gets an A for attendance? I thought teachers didn’t do that.

  25. Prior to the trade, I considered the Warriors’ best lineup to be the following: Lee, Green, Thompson, Iggy and Curry.

    I now think the Warriors’ best lineup is this: Lee, Iggy (at 4), Thompson, Curry and Jordan.

    Note that the first lineup, while bigger and better defensively, and excellent in its own right, had two players you could cheat off of to double Curry. This second lineup, with the ability to move Curry off the ball, and making Iggy virtually unguardable — seriously crazy.

    It would require the right Nellieball coach to make it work though — balls to the wall. How Don Nelson would have loved this team. It’s the apotheosis of everything he ever wanted in a roster.

  26. Best line-up for Warriors should still include Bogut. The team’s performance this year amply demonstrates that small line-up is not our best line-up on court. The Warriors wouldn’t enjoy the record they do if they mostly played small ball. Nellie would have played small ball on rear occasions if he was the the coach.

    If healthy, Iggy should be in the best line-up. But with Iggy still obviously still suffering from his hamstring injury, either Iggy or Thompson should not be included in best line-up. Can see Jordan Crawford included in best line-up.

    Crawford will really help the Warriors. At PG, he shot 51 percent from the field, and opponents shot 42 percent. A huge upgrade over Douglas on both sides of the ball. An indication that a Crawford-Curry backcourt at various times will be very effective.

    And alhough Brooks averaged few minutes playing for Boston, when playing SF he shot 50% from the field, and opponent SF’s shot only 39%. He’s a better SF than SG.

  27. Feltbot, Dre at 4 and Jordan Crawford as part of your best 5 man rotation even without ever seeing Jordan Crawford play with dubs yet ?? You are serious, right ?

    Two of the three of Green, Lee and Bogut should be on floor or will get burned by lack of rebounds, ironically like end of last game when dubs lost game since unable to secure defensive rebounds.

  28. The 5 man data shows that the starters, with Bogut, have been effective in large minutes.

    Felty’s favorites have played very few minutes, but are actually more effective according to the 5 man data. That could be misleading because of situational factors, but I always wonder when a very effective unit doesn’t see very many minutes.

    The 5 man data shows that the team suffers when AI sits. Barnes looks like a black hole in this data.

    Baze, Speights and TD are a near guarantee of failure. Fortunately, the recent move and the fact that JON and Ezeli will eventually return give me hope.

    • Rick, I’d be curious to know which site you’re using to generate that data. Thanks.

      • The 5 man data is at 82games.com. Sorry, I wasn’t trying to be mysterious. It’s in the big box on the left. You can also click the players name and get the 5 man units he was in. Scroll a bit.

        I also follow gameflow charts at popcorn machine and I usually use basketballreference for the rest.

        • Not to toot my own horn, but have you given nbawowy.com a look yet?

          Just thought I’d mention it in case not.

          • Yeah I’ve tried a few times and must be an idiot because I can’t figure out how to use it.

          • Feel free to post tutorials on your site here Evan. I’d like to learn how to use it, and I’m sure others would as well.

          • EZ – Congrats on a FANTASTIC site!

            FB – (I’m stuck at my computer this morn, so I’ll save EZ some typing here.) For a simple oncourt/offcourt comparison of Barnes:

            1. Pick a team (Warriors)
            2. Pick a time frame (defaults to current season)
            3. Pick a player (Barnes) from the “on court” list.
            4. Hit “Submit.” Check the stats. Note the different tabs on the results section. The “team” and “opponent” tabs are particularly telling.
            5. Hit the “Swap” button. It moves Barnes to “off court.”
            6. Hit “Submit.” Check the stats.

            Walla. The Ws have scored noticeably worse with Barnes on court, plus opponents score better.

            But of course whole-team results are highly dependent on with whom Barnes plays. So to see Barnes’ effect on only the starting 5, put 4 starting players + Barnes on the on-court list, get the numbers, then replace Barnes with the 5th starter, and compare the results. (The differences are still pretty dramatic.)

    • Jackson’s misuse of the bench caused them to stink. Mixed lineups are/were needed to improve their time on the court. The guards in particular have not had the proper chance to spell Curry. (Douglas especially).

  29. Just to clarify the above, by “best lineup” I don’t mean best starting lineup, nor even a lineup that should be played major minutes. I simply mean the best lineup by plus/minus when used tactically. And as Rick notes above, that analysis is somewhat corrupted by situational factors. Like when Jackson chooses to play it.

    I agree that Bogut should have been on the court for defensive possessions at the end of last game. And I agree that Green should have played in place of Barnes throughout crunch time.

    But it should be noted that Iggy did play some four for George Karl in crunch time last year, and very effectively. He’s a superb rebounder in his own right.

  30. feltbot, Dre barely played as PF and failed at it last year in those barely played mins.

    http://www.82games.com/1213/12DEN5.HTM#bypos

    He is also good rebounder at SF but with his size(he is smaller than Klay, Green and Barnes) will be a huge failure at PF. No coach that has current team will play Dre at PF not when there are 4 other better options.

    • OK I might be wrong about this. But 82 games might not be completely right either. Late last season I think the Nuggets had some success with a Gallo at 5, Chandler and Iggy interchangeable at the forwards, crunchtime unit. It might be difficult to assign positions on that.

      Don Nelson and many others had a ton of success playing guys the same size as Iggy at PF at certain times of the game. So I’d be careful about calling it a guaranteed failure.

      Regardless, I don’t think it will be something we see much of from MJ. I was just musing.

  31. Glad we’re all on the same page regarding playing time for various player combinations. Go Warriors!

  32. Barnes in 19 minutes:

    4 FGA, 0 PTS, 0 REB, 0 AST, 0 STL, 0 BLK, 2 TOV, 5 PF

    But he’ll probably get more minutes than Draymond next game. So much fail. Was Dunleavy ever this bad?

  33. I was sold on Crawford the first time I saw him bring the ball up. They should sub him for Curry, Igoudala (especially now he’s hurt and not scoring), and Klay now and up his minutes. Sub time let him run with Brooks. The pair might be able to score and mix things up. Green can fill in throughout.

    And let Barnes sit until he proves he should be on the court. Does anyone have stats on how much he’s scored with the subs? He just drags them down and I suspect his stats there are abysmal.

    I don’t want to sell Speights short. A mobile big who can score (and hit free throws) could made a huge difference on the team.

    If he only had a brain.

    I guess I’m doing a Wizard of Oz thing here.

    • To a large extent, Speights’ brain will be supplied by his point guard. As we saw tonight, in a very good two-way performance. He just got a good pg to play with, for the first time all season. Give it time.

  34. If the FO is in the mood to deal, a mid-range player with some experience, who can score fairly well, and who has an edge could made a difference down the stretch. A 3 or a 4. I still want to see them bringing up a potential PG.

    • If they dropped Barnes and Bazemore and picked up that player, I could see their bringing McGuire up, just for games like tonight’s.

    • The way this team is built, the only tradable asset is Barnes. And his value is likely dropping faster than a thing that drops really fast.

      And good luck finding a team that is so interested in Barnes that they take the salary of a Speights with him (which would be necessary to get back anyone other than a rookie scale contract).

      • I would much rather keep Speights over Barnes, mostly because of his size. But he doesn’t perform badly when he has a good supporting cast, and his contributions tonight weren’t trivial. And unlike the Tin Man and the Cowardly Lion and Barnes, Speights does have a heart and courage.

        I’m not dumping on Barnes. His performance really does approach pathology. There are so many things he should be doing now that he isn’t. There is some kind of problem.

        • “I would much rather keep Speights over Barnes, mostly because of his size. ”

          I don’t think you see the issue here. It’s with salary. You can’t trade Barnes for a veteran because the salaries won’t match. I think we’d have to include Speights to make such a deal work.

          • Depends on what they can do with the trade exceptions. Their salaries are only 600k apart, 2.9m and 3.5. Bazemore adds $800k. I think moto said they have some bucks left?

          • You’re not going to find significant veterans that cost less than the MLE. Are you?

  35. You have to wonder if the poor performance of Barnes and most of the bench is not dragging the starters down. And they must expect to carry a heavy load and heavy minutes every night. Players with an edge could pick things up. Brooks might even have it.

  36. As I see it, Speights is the LEAST of the Warriors problems right now. In fact, I believe more strongly than ever that he will prove a positive.

    My top 3 Warriors problems:

    1) Iggy’s health. Durant doesn’t dominate to the extent he did, nor do Denver’s smalls, if he’s anything like himself. 30 minutes only in a big game? More evidence, if u need it.

    2) Crawford not yet integrated.

    3) Management requiring Jackson to play Barnes. I have a sixth sense this may come to a head soon.

  37. Is Barnes being shopped? I’m searching for reasons why he would suddenly and utterly stop competing.

    If so, I wonder if the Magic would give up Tobias Harris for him? I would love that deal.

    • Did you happen to see my exchange with ESS about this the other day?

      • No is it on your timeline?

          • thank you for sharing those communications w. Strauss, Professor Z. he basically said he wouldn’t be your mouthpiece because he’s not on your payroll, he has deadlines that demand sticking to more rewarding story lines, and he expects the preacher to deny that green is clearly the more productive player. confirmation of my opinion of espn and its tributaries like warriorsworld, that they serve marketing and entertainment and not news. can’t expect guts and substance from the younger sibling of disney.

          • Read that twitter exchange. Yikes.

            That’s the first time I’ve ever seen a so-called “journalist” admit that he’s paid to avoid some questions.

            Is ESS asking for donations now? I wonder how much he would charge to ask the obvious question about Green’s playing time v. Barnes’.

      • By the way, ESS has joined Tim Kawakami in blocking me on twitter. Neither can accept being critiqued in the same fashion they critique others.

        • I’m not surprised. I think the main reason he won’t ask about Barnes is not because it’s a tough question to ask, but because it makes him look bad for having been Barnes’ biggest supporter in the whole “Replace Lee with Barnes” fiasco of an idea.

          It’s difficult to be an objective reporter and a blogger with opinions at the same time.

          • I agree. I had no desire to accept a credential for that reason. I don’t want anything getting between me and my opinions.

  38. OK so my two cents:
    -Durant had probably the best shooting night of his career. How much of that was Durant being on fire and how much of it was the lack of consistent doubling? I feel like Curry faced more defensive pressure than Durant in this game and that’s just silly.
    -Crawford looked terrific out there, turnovers notwithstanding. The warriors desperately needed a third ball handler too.
    -Barnes was comically horrific. I feel like he’s developing a Rudy Gay type game minus the talent.
    -Curry shot extremely well for a change. Hope he can sustain it. The turnovers are still a major issue though and are definitely the biggest barrier to him becoming a true superstar player.
    -Bogut played very poorly on both ends. Does that make his benching in the 2nd half justifiable? I don’t think so. The defensive drop-off from him to Speights is simply too large.
    -Iguodala… Is it time to be worried about his health long term? Plenty of players are “iron men” and “freak athletes” until suddenly they’re not. Not everybody can be John Stockton…
    -Lee continues to struggle mightily against athletic bigs. The lack of pump faking is kind of bizarre, especially for such a crafty offensive player. It wouldn’t magically solve his problems but it would go a long way.

  39. Yes, as Mr. Feltbot says above, the evidence shows Andre Iguodala is still injured.

    And seems like to me Harrison Barnes is also still injured. Is turf-toe a career ender, or does it eventually heal?

    • I read that in 50% of cases, turf toe can take up to 5 years to fully heal. Jimmy Butler had it, and says it might bother him for the rest of his career. Our FO is silent on the matter.

    • My doc sez “turf toe” is an imprecise term used to cover a lot of possible different injuries.

      Depending on the specific nature of the injury, it can heal up quickly with no future problems, or it could be a chronic problem, or anything in between.

      Since the Ws choose not to come clean on injuries, we can’t know if Barnes is still having pain or weakness. Maybe he’s running on 1.5 feet. Maybe we’re seeing him at his best. The Ws won’t say.

      In any case, I’m pretty sure the Ws have never uttered the words “turf toe” in association with Barnes. That was Dr. Felt’s diagnosis. The Ws have only said “foot injury.”

      • Another thought:

        If FB is right and the Barnes situation is due for a change, it’s possible that the team could use his “injury” as the reason for benching him.

        The team’s general refusal to discuss injuries leaves them a lot of latitude there. They can always play the “injured” card, or the “recovered” card, regardless of the medical facts.

        Keeping that freedom of action is the only reason I can see for not discussing player health.

  40. Big reader, harass many of you on twitter but have never posted.
    Felt, a quick suggestion. Since your threads are the most informative by a mile, I read most everything. That said, I don’t know how to do it per se, but you should have it so when links are clicked on your site, an additional tab opens said link. For example, I just went to read Evanz’ thread he posted and when I had to come back I had to sift through 100 comments to find my spot.
    Little dumb thing and I don’t know if your blog platform has the option to do it, but it would greatly help the user experience.
    Keep up the good analysis. Carry on…

    • Unless you’re using an ipad or other tablet… just right mouse click and “open in new tab”. I never just click on links directly for that very reason. You’d be amazed how many websites (stupidly) navigate you away from their own page when clicking on a link.

    • I just learned something new. I always had the same problem as mcguins, but just accepted it as a fact of life.

      Glad to know of the mouse tricks, but I think I also have the option somewhere to automatically have links open in a new tab. Is everyone OK with that? Any possible problems?

    • OK, I’ve looked into this and there’s no easy solution — I’d have to change the code in my blog, which I’d rather not get into.

      So I’d recommend using the right click methods described above.

      • Oh, I forgot the best one. He lobbied for Kent Bazemore to be the backup point guard as opposed to re-signing JJ.

        Now, things worked out well with us getting Iguodala. But can you imagine how awful we’d be now if we let JJ go, didn’t have Iguodala, and Kent Bazemore was actually the backup point guard (oh, wait that last part has pretty much happened most of the season).

  41. Most of Strauss’s comments, positive or negative, are just plain stupid. How did he get his gig and what constraints might ESPN put on him? I’m curious.

  42. “Recent rumors suggested that the Warriors are receiving calls from other teams, who are inquiring about the availability of Harrison Barnes and Klay Thompson. Sources said that the Warriors will eventually trade one of them to fill in the gap on their point guard rotation.

    “Trading Thompson makes no sense for the Warriors since the third-year shooting guard is having another breakout year. The 23-year-old streak-shooter is averaging 19.3 points per game this season to go along with 3.2 rebounds and 2.6 assists per contest.

    “Barnes, on the other hand, is averaging 11.3 points and 4.0 rebounds per game this season, but sources close to the situation noted that the Warriors are slowly losing their patience on the second-year forward due to his inconsistency.”

    http://www.jobsnhire.com/articles/8070/20140117/nba-nba-trade-rumors-nba-trade-rumors-2014-golden-state-warriors-klay-thompson-harrison-barnes-golden-state-warriors-roster-stephen-curry-chicago-bulls-toronto-raptors.htm

    Is this site any good?

    • The problem with the idea on that site is that trading Barnes for a guard leaves Green and Thompson as the only backup 3s. The team could make that work, but it limits their flexibility somewhat, especially if Iggy is still hurting.

      • Hat, we already have too many wings. Draymond should have been getting most of Barnes’ minutes all along. I don’t think we miss Barnes one bit if he’s gone.

        The problem is his salary can’t bring back anyone significant. And his trade value is probably shallower than a bathtub at this point.

        All things many of us saw coming months ago, if not more.

        • Maybe you’re right, but I have this suspicion that Iggy is going to need some more time off soon.

          Re trading Barnes, my understanding is that the team still has trade exception $$ left over that they could throw into a deal. I’m not sure how that works, but I think it means they could “trade up” in salary if they could find a trade partner willing to “trade down” in talent.

          That leaves the Ws over the lux tax line, though, and I don’t see them going there unless they get a really fantastic player out of the deal.

  43. If Barnes is playing injured, he doesn’t have the experience and guile (and maybe something else) to compensate and contribute in other ways. His athleticism is about his only asset.

    Iguodala likely is playing injured, but still is useful. And they have to have him on court. But they don’t have to have Barnes on the court—Green could take more of his minutes.

    If injury is the cause and it’s likely to linger for some time, the team in in a bind. If the FO is still committed to him, they keep playing him, hoping he can play through it. But we’re getting diminishing returns, and it really has to be questioned what he adds, what he detracts, as they look to the playoffs.

    Or could they be trying to feature him now in the hopes he plays well and can attract a buyer?

  44. Did McGuire go up against Durant when we had him, and if so, how did he do?

    I must confess I was envious of the Collison/Adams harassment last night. As frustrated as I am with the FO’s focus on “defensive” players, I wouldn’t mind a role player in this role, who could play alongside Green or spell him.

    If the Warriors could pick up a 3, really a utility player, on the order of Crawford, i.e. aggressive with some skills and experience and offense oriented but fairly young and not expensive, they could throw all kinds of looks at teams. Especially if they picked up a real enforcer.

    The assumption here, of course, is that Barnes and Bazemore go. They’ll need someone to spell Igoudala, even fill in, and play with the subs. Green could get plenty of minutes in a variety of lineups.

    I still want them to find a PG prospect to bring along, even if only someone on the order of Patty Mills.

    • You’re talking about Dominic McGuire? No way in hell do I want that scrub taking minutes from Draymond. He has enough problem getting on the court with Barnes and Speights taking minutes from him.

      • Agree 1000% in principle, but DG didn’t slow down Durant last night. If McG could (I don’t remember), then let’s sign him up.

        • McGuire would have been roasted even worse than DG. Durant was just on fire last night. DG had a hand in his face on every shot that I saw.

          • Yeah, DG played him well, but Durant can (and did) simply shoot over him. McG is listed @ 6’9″, to Green’s (not even) 6’7″.

          • Hat, don’t make the mistake of relying on scalp height! Draymond Green has a 7’1″ wingspan and 8’9″ standing reach. Dom has a 6’10.6″ wingspan and 8’8″ standing reach.

            It’s my mission in life to get people to move away from top of the head height. It matters much more where the tips of your fingers are!

          • I’ve noticed that Dray has unusually long arms, but wow!

            Please don’t tell me where you got that wingspan info. I’ve already reached my max on geekitude. Thanks!

      • Yes, Dominic, and again, how did he do if he was on Durant?

        He wouldn’t take minutes from Green, but instead come in for spot harassment. There might be times they could play together, especially with Crawford now.

        And again, the assumption is Barnes and Bazemore go. There are two players on the roster who can’t or shouldn’t come in except in a blowout, Kuzmic and Nedovic, three if you include Bazemore, and four if you include Barnes. The idea is to get some versatility and use out of the bench.

  45. Watching the game last night, it struck me that the Thunder might be even more dangerous without Westbrook, because it means Durant gets more touches.

    And the Ws don’t have a good answer for Durant, or they didn’t last night. I was surprised that Mr. Defensive Coach Guy didn’t try more stuff against him.

    - Work to prevent entry passes to him. That’s admittedly difficult, but it didn’t appear to be even attempted last night.

    - Foul his ass immediately, the instant he touches the ball. Burn through all your non-shooting fouls on Durant only (I think of that as the Stephen Jackson technique).

    - Set traps and double-teams, to get the ball out of his hands – let anyone else try to beat you, but not him. The Ws tried that part of the time, and not others. When they did attempt it, the help D was too often too late.

    On the other hand, the officiating didn’t allow much physicality last night. Except for Curry and Bogut, every Warrior who played more than 16 minutes finished with 4+ fouls. The last couple of times the teams met, the Ws were more successful in pushing Durant off his happy spots. Even Barnes did well at that the last time around.

    Whatever. Back to the drawing board. Unless the Ws can come up with some defensive answers, it’s likely to be a short and disappointing playoff season.

  46. What the last two games has shown us is that the Warriors main problem is not obtaining a decent back-up point guard. For even though Crawford has shot quite well the Warriors main problem is not having a defender who can augment Bogut who himself seems to be suffering from fatigue or an injury. The Thunder shooting 58 percent from the field for the game is all one has to know regarding the Warriors problems in the front court.

    And neither Speights not D. Green is an adequate answer. Nor will the return of JON and Ezeli solve the apparent weakness for not have a decent big behind D. Lee.

    And it’s clear that the Warriors starting line-up presently has no decent
    defender given that Iggy is still feeling the effects of his injury and is limited on defense as he is on offense. And for those who want to claim that Thompson is a decent defender, I just don’t see it. What I do see is opponent’s easily streaking by him.

    The Warriors are playing a high price for not having developed Dedmon when he was with the Warriors. His skills set is so above Speights it’s not even close. I doubt that Speights could not even make a d league team. Even playing against the Thunder when he provided the Warrior with a net 2 extra possessions via offensive rebounds, and went 4-4 from the field and 4-6 front the foul line, the Thunder shot 61 percent from the field when he was on the court mainly due to his ineptness. And the Warriors for the year are a minus 11 in games he was on the court. The Warriors should start by releasing Bazemore, Kusmic or Nedovic, and bringing up Dedmon in the interim. But more importantly they have to trade Barnes and shore up the front court.

    And why Bazemore is playing and not Brooks is plain stupid. He has proved to be useless.

    The Warriors have to address the front court problem if they are to succeed in the playoffs.

    All these discussions about who is the best line-up is irrelevant as I’m more concerned about the make-up of the roster. And to argue that a small line-up is our best line-up and that it does’t have to be on the court much makes no sense at all.

    And I’m sure most of the discussions will be about how Jackson played the wrong players or ran the wrong plays or defenses, or match-ups, when all these arguments pale in comparison as to who should be on the roster.

    But, I will say that Jackson in not having a player trying to deny Durant getting the ball was the dumbest thing I ever saw. For if he had less possessions he would have had less shots.

    For now, Curry and Lee are carrying the Warriors, not Iggy and Thompson, and such is simply not good enough.

    Go Niners.

    • Are you suggesting Bogut isn’t impacting the game defensively? His def rating numbers during the two losses were on par with the season while the team blew out by ~25%. He looked like a healthy top 5 defensive center in tonight’s game too.

    • Dedmon won’t be brought anywhere by GS because he’s under contract to Phi and playing in the bigs already, for them. Mr.Barnes, by himself, won’t bring anyone in a trade that would help the team this season because of the $$ amount on his contract and the allowable trades under the c.b.a. in theory, he could be traded for a player on a minimum deal (like bazemore) or someone also on his rookie contract, but competent players still playing for that scale are not traded away, they’re how teams get built.

  47. The damage Barnes does to the team’s ball movement is incredible. A combination of no court vision, no creativity, no ball skills and no ability to contribute offensively without being force fed. His lone assist came from a long three that Crawford was forced to take to bail him out of yet another failed iso. A (much) less talented Rudy Gay?

  48. Thanks for the right click trick. Would totally solve the problem…if you could right click on a mac. However, apple usually has shortcuts for such things and the first thing I tried worked- holding down the command button as I clicked simply makes any link a new window. Thanks for the tips, they got me thinking.
    I tweeted a scary fact tonight- Barnes has had more fouls than COLLECTIVE pts/reb/asst on each of the past two games. Now, I said it with a few minutes left in garbage time, but his turnovers and fouls still equalled the collective three categories.
    I was just on the warriorsworld podcast this past week and talked about Barnes in a relatively understanding manner. I acknowledged that Green is everything Barnes is not, but was forgiving because of how a lifetime starter’s head may be after a beast like Iggy came into his spot, which he held his entire rookie year and was ultimately successful in. However, the past two games have pushed me over the edge. He is horrible. Anthony Randolph Jr. I wanted him traded when the value was high, which it really was…and really is currently not. Imagine if we had gotten Lowry for Barnes and filler. I’m very happy with the Crawford trade, but Lowry would have changed the game.
    One thing I was going to talk about on the pod but never had the time to is something I have never seen discussed anywhere-
    We could have taken Andre Drummond in lieu of Barnes. Wow.

    • The fact that we could have drafted Drummond, or my favorite at the time John Henson, has been discussed ad nauseum in other forums that I frequent and on Twitter.

      Hey, but silver lining. Jackson would hardly play Drummond!

  49. I’m appreciating what Bogut is doing this year. He is doing all they could have ever hoped…
    Buttttt…let’s play the pretend game. Help me out here Evanz.
    They draft Drummond, an undeniable franchise center, young and cheap. He gets AB’s back up 22 min this year to instill faith. We trade Bogut at the deadline when the stock is high, or simply get a ton of cap room on the expiring…the possibilities are endless. Let’s just say AD and AB are equally as good, which they are this year. Can you imagine this squad with 15M in cap space next year? Can’t think of a vet who wants to win that wouldn’t put us at the top of the list.
    Anyhow, sorry to bring the ad nauseum here, but fun to think about.
    That said, still digging what is going down this season.
    What do you guys think Barnes + x could yield if Myers pulls off more wizardry?

    • Barnes + Speights works for Henson and Ridnour..
      Dump Bazemore and pick up Reggie Williams.

      Flame on?

      • No way Bucks give up Henson for Barnes. That team in 3 years is going to be potent with Giannis, Henson, and possibly a #1 pick. The Bucks are my second favorite team to watch because of those two. And that’s not even mentioning Khris Middleton, a second rounder who has turned out to be better than Barnes (but who isn’t these days?).

        I can’t even imagine how good they might be if they land Embiid or Exum.

  50. More disturbing than Barnes struggles is the lack of an offense that can get anyone open shots. If you notice, the Warriors are scoring on isolations and Curry wizardry.

    When Curry is not in the game, no one scores because no one gets open shots from a nonexistent offense. Everything is 1 on 1. Crawford has already looked pretty good and he can create his own shot, but for any other reserves to score, the offensive system must improve.

  51. SOLD, but why the hell would Mil do it?
    They are staked in bigs, but Henson is outplaying Sanders. They are dumb enough though…

    • I’m sure they would say no that, but if you substitue Ridnour for Neil, who was rumored to be on the block then you never know. Problem is that i can recall if Neil was much of a floor general in SA. I like his game though when he played in that system.

  52. I’ll put in a word for Bogut, though he hardly had competition at center. On a night when shooting was off, when Lee had his hands full, when the team was tired from a b-to-b, Bogut helped ensure a win in an ugly game, and there will be more as the season progresses. He got his boards and his points, and did make good stops at the rim.

    Crawford continues to impress. He looks like he means business and intends to deliver. He’d do better with a better supporting cast. Bench Barnes and Bazemore. Let’s see what Brooks can do. Did they play together much at Boston? That would be a plus. He’d also set up Speights and Green would find a way to fit in. Passing to Barnes is a waste of offensive time and energy.

  53. I have zero bogut complaints. he has been a beast.
    15-10-5 tonight. absolutely could not ask for more.

  54. Pingback: Warriors 111 Clippers 92: The Crossmatch Returns - Feltbot's Warriors Blog

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