Pre-Game Jitters: Warriors at Hawks

Golden State Warriors, best in the West. Atlanta Hawks, best in the East.

This should be a crazy fun game. Not just the two best teams in the league playing, but two teams that are very similar in structure and principles. Two coaches from the Popovich tree, stressing ball-movement and pace. Two teams built on Nellieball principles, with tough as nails stretch-fours and long three-point shooting wings. Two teams that play with high character and utter unselfishness.          

Two teams that play the beautiful game.

As far as differences go, the Warriors have two clear superstars, and the Hawks arguably none. The Hawks, on the other hand, have balanced scoring from all five positions, while the Warriors have limited offensive skill all across their front line. On defense, the Warriors have a clear edge. Better rim protection from Bogut than Horford, Klay much better than Korver, Green better than Millsap.

A couple of matchups will fascinate me:

Draymond v Millsap: Two players close to the same size, and equally tough. Millsap is much more skilled offensively, and indeed I think is the Hawks leading scorer this season. Which argues in the Warriors favor doesn’t it? Green is perfectly placed in the Warriors defense in this game.

If I were Coach Bud, I would do what almost every coach in the NBA has failed to do so far to neutralize Draymond. Pull Millsap all the way out to the three point line, removing Dray from the Warriors’ interior defense. You’d think that would be obvious to a great coach with Dirk Nowitzki,  wouldn’t you? But no, Rick Carlisle fell into the same trap as everyone else, and tried to post Dray up. Eat stone, Rick Carlisle. Let’s see if Coach Bud is any smarter.

If the Warriors win this game, it will likely have to do with Green shutting down his man.

Bogut v Horford: I assume this is one road game that Bogut will show up for. Unfortunately, he hasn’t looked that great since coming back from his knee injury.

I expect the Hawks to attack this matchup with a fury. Horford has a deadly midrange shot, and pulling Bogut out of the lane has obvious benefits. Expect a lot of high-post action.

I also expect a ton of Teague-Horford pick and roll. Teague is a lightning-quick nightmare, and pick and roll defense is a noted Bogut weakness. Keep a close eye on the Warriors pick and roll coverages, as Ron Adams will have his hands full.

Other matchups: Curry will have a real tough time staying in front of Teague. Will the Warriors crossmatch? The Warriors’ last two losses came against Teague-like guards (Westbrook and Rose), so defending the point-guard will be a major concern. On the other side of the ball, Teague will have no answer for Curry.

The Klay-Korver matchup likely will not occur, as if I’m the Hawks I crossmatch here. Get the great defender DeMarre Carroll on Klay, and hide Korver on Barnes. Even if they do matchup, the final numbers would be unfair to Korver. He has a far lower usage rate in the Hawks’ balanced attack. But there is little doubt that Klay is by far the better all-around player, and still growing into his game.

Barnes should have a chance to shine if guarded by Korver. Can he?

The Hawks are not a great rebounding team. Will Kerr have the Warriors crash the offensive boards? Another area where Barnes might shine.

Bench play will be a concern. The Hawks have a good scoring backup point guard in Dennis Schroder (pronounce at your own risk) and stretch the floor. But the Warriors bench veterans have stepped up their games lately, particularly Iggy and Barbosa, who the Warriors have been using as their own attacking point guard.

That’s all I got. Let’s rumble.

100 Responses to Pre-Game Jitters: Warriors at Hawks

  1. Thanks Feltbot!

    I’ve missed these pre-game jitters the last 4 years. I was hoping that now that we have a competent coaching staff again they would make a comeback and appear more frequently.

    Can not wait for this game!

  2. rgg must be salivating over this match-up for his next 10000 word Bogut (dis)missive.

    I expect to see a air amount of Green/Lee/Speights on Horford if his midrange starts falling early tonight. Sadly, this opens the floodgates for Teague attacking the rim. As you said, Kerr and Adams have their hands full game planning this one. Should be a good one.

    • You have an odd way of seeing things, WaB, but you are the one who is questioning Bogut here, making the same argument, I think, I’ve made before.

  3. A letdown from the Dallas game may occur, especially by Steph, so a loss won’t be disappointing. Atlanta’s defense is not top grade? I don’t know. Will the Warriors be able to push the pace and move the ball? Find offense from others if perimeter shooting is off?

    • @88

      I certainly do know what a tautology is, rgg. Indeed, there are varying forms of tautologies. An example of a logical tautology is the following:

      Either it will rain today or it will not rain today.

      I simply was making the point that Felt, in essence, is creating logical tautologies all the time by making claim “x” and then later on, making claim “y”–which is essentially the opposite of “x.” He doesn’t explicitly link them with an “or” as would be necessary in a formal tautology. Nevertheless, the “or” is elided by Felt in order to have it both ways. I was simply pointing that out.

      As for Felt “sensibly” ignoring me: you’re absolutely right; he knows he wouldn’t stand a chance.

      What began all of this was my pointing out that Felt was clearly making the case that the W’s needed to shake things up by re-inserting Lee into the starting lineup. He said I was purposely misrepresenting him in saying this and claimed that I was “listening to voices in my head.” He even went so far as to refute my claim directly in a subsequent blog.

      And now lookee here: Felt this week came out straight advocating re-inserting Lee into the starting lineup. What a surprise!

      And as far as having “complex” and “coherent” arguments (and why don’t we throw in “well summarized” and “tightly argued,” as that article you cited with admiration elsewhere pushed for) your outstanding reputation on this blog as far as these are concerned is rather clear. Fellow posters can hardly wait for your 10000 word (as summarized by another poster) “tightly argued summaries”–not to mention your incessant commenting on your commenting on your own comments, ad infinitum. But please don’t insult me for not possessing your preternatural talents in this regard…

      • Then I see you are using a logical tautology, loosely and carelessly, and not the rhetorical, the latter by far more common in usage. And I suppose you’re aware of Wittgenstein’s objection that all deductive statements are tautologies. Which puts in mind almost all your comments. I assume you are also aware of the fallacy of composition, circular reasoning, and proof by verbosity, upon all of which you depend.

        In no way have you demonstrated Feltbot’s statements are tautologies in either sense, but even if they are, that this error might be significant in any way. Feltbot, like all of us here, will entertain propositions and make arguments over time, which will shift to meet changes. It is assumed we keep up. We don’t repeat the whole argument. And all of Feltbot’s arguments have been constructed here over years and imply a context, a larger picture, which you seem incapable of grasping.

        That Barnes might be traded was supported by serious reasoning. That most likely he won’t doesn’t refute the reasons, only shows that he may be factually wrong, which is not significant in the least. We predict here. If the predictions don’t come true, the reasons behind those predictions remain and have validity. Feltbot has repeatedly said Green should play both 3 and 4—

        There’s no point going further. I have yet to see you even show you recognize what has been said by anyone or its basic argument, then refute that with any reasoned thought on your own. Rather you pick a piece, find objection, yet you never put that objection into any larger context. It’s impossible to know where you’re coming from, and it’s not clear you’re coming from anywhere.

        Yet you make large sweeping announcements, without demonstration or analysis, and your main force of argument seems to be we’re supposed to take your word for it.


        • Meant to add argumentum ad hominem, which seems to be your main staple and primary source of delight.

        • I never endeavored to prove that Felt’s wildly gyrating pronouncements were tautologies in the tightest logical sense and made this clear at the time. But I did point out the “Lucky 13” examples which were very explicit statements/arguments he made and then contradicted with the near opposite statement/argument elsewhere. Naturally we are all allowed to change our minds but the extreme nature and frequent amount of this calls into serious question whether Felt knows what he’s talking about.

          The Barnes trade prediction was never argued with any depth beyond the asinine claim that Joe Lacob forced Kerr to start Barnes in order to “showcase” him for a trade that would definitely take place by the trading deadline. This assertion was patently absurd and swopa demolished it elsewhere (no need to pile on!). And now, finally, Felt is trying to quietly walk it back.

          However, I never mentioned this in my post to you. Instead, I mentioned another thing that Felt was patently wrong about (i.e. that Felt was arguing for Lee to be reinserted into the starting lineup)–and to which I made very lengthy and substantiated arguments. I was right about this as well and, for obvious reasons, you chose to ignore this.

          But please note that I get no jollies being right about these types of things because they’re so obviously ridiculous and there’s nothing to be proud about noticing such patently absurd things.

          BTW, interesting that you’re assailing me for my “verbosity.” Again, please check your own reputation in this regard…

          • Your comment reinforces much of what I said above. Sigh.

            Actually, I wish my comments were longer and I were better at this. I usually try to do several things: frame the total argument and it put it in context, outline a general strategic point, provide sample games for comparison along with quotes from sources that reinforce points if I can find them.

            What I find is that the people who object to length don’t like what I say and never bother to read or respond directly. Not upset here. Barnes gets praised, I provide scouting reports, stats, etc.., plus, of course some sarcasm. We get that here. What I find is that next thing I know I get accused of being a Barnes hater. I believe you took delight in that, LT.

            I wish comments by others were longer as well. I’d like to see more analysis, better analysis. Many just make a general pronouncement, maybe throw in a questionable stat, and expect the rest to be bowled over.

            This isn’t a fan club.

          • Incidentally, we will never get a direct answer from Lacob, for obvious reasons. But his investment in Barnes and heavy influence in the draft were well documented here, using his own words. Again, you and others don’t read this. The rest was speculation, but reasonable speculation. Ignored by you and others.

  4. The Warriors haven’t faced a team like the Hawks yet. But the inverse is true also, even multiplied. If Harrison is on KK, which would make sense to me, his job on D will be very simple. Don’t lose him! And show some aggression and abuse him as much as possible on the other end. Can he? Great question.
    I’m not even sure we’ll see that match-up.

    • we’ll see barnes on korver some of the time, but expect more iguodala and thompson there, because away from the ball they do a far better job accounting for floor and air space. barnes will probably be assigned to carroll. millsap added 3 pt. shooting since his UT days, and if green has to stay on the perimeter with him it could be a game changer. when kerr was forced to put d’mond on durant vs. OK, his defense was left without help inside or on the defensive boards. of course, this goes back to how many minutes bogut can sustain, but even when he’s on the court he’d rather have his security chief green watching his back.

      • Yeah, Carroll a “better” match for Barnes on D I would think for the very reasons you just cited. Demarre is another complete mystery to me. I remember watching him play a bit in the Tourney , with or against Darrell Arthur for Kansas(?)
        Felbots take of hiding Korver on Barnes is succinct, even obvious. I’d be shocked if KKorve guarded anyone else when HB is on the floor.

      • Not completely such a negative thing to keep Milsap away from the rim. Would not defend Korver with Barnes. Barnes would defend Milsap better than Korver or Carroll.

  5. Longtimer:
    “I only want there to be consistency and depth in his arguments. I’ve been really disappointed in the real lack of quality this year.”

    This whole blog is devoted to hoops. How much more depth do you want?

    You said you’ve only been here 7 weeks. Kinda hard to compare quality unless you’ve read a couple years worth of back posts.

    I think your posts would benefit from more conciseness. They can be all over the map. But they hold a strange attraction for me. At least the shorter ones do.

    • Thanks for the complinsult–or whatever that was!

      As stated elsewhere, I think Felt’s analytical prowess has really suffered this year as compared with last year. I admit that I have no interest in revisiting Felt’s blogs from years ago. I am also beginning to wonder if I overestimated Felt last year. It’s much easier to look smart when criticizing a team and coaching staff with obvious failings than to apply intelligent and subtle analyses to a highly successful team. I suspect that Felt is all out of sorts this year because continuing to apply his highly critical shtick this year doesn’t make sense and is having the unintended consequence of exposing his weak and contradictory arguments. He also doesn’t do subtle well at all. But I certainly hope this is an aberration that can be corrected.

      As for my posts being all over the map, I just don’t see that. As far as them being longer than most (except the attack miniature poodle’s), guilty as charged! No need to read them if you don’t want…

      • That’s swell, LT, you’ve made your evaluation of FB, now let’s get off literary crit and back to bball, OK?

        Got any thoughts you’d like to share about tonight’s game?

        • First, don’t shake up the starting lineup!

          Bogut’s not looked good since the knee injury (save one or two games). He really looked slow against the Mavs and am curious how he does against the quicker Horford.

          DLee didn’t play much against the Mavs so I expect 25+ minutes from him–and a nice game given Atlanta’s lack of a strong interior defensive presence. Expect to see him at the 5 and–contrary to what many are predicting (i.e. the W’s trying to replicate the Pelicans’ success by going big) they will end up countering the Hawks with smaller lineups. Having Horford cover Lee might be a strong strategy.

          The Hawks don’t like to switch at all but play very disciplined team defense. The W’s must be crisp with their passing, set good screens–and try more high PnR’s.

          I expect to see Draymond on Horford for much of the time.

          It will be interesting to see if the “web-like” switching D of the W’s can be neutralized by the highly disciplined Hawks offense.


          • Couldn’t respond more thoroughly earlier, but a few free minutes now:

            First of all, thank you for responding with bball thoughts.

            I don’t personally care about Felt changing his position based on new info. A smart better would always do that, in fact. “Barnes being showcased for a trade” wasn’t a bad guess earlier this season. “Barnes not being traded in the next couple of weeks” is also not a bad guess right this minute, given what we’ve seen from Barnes, the availability of better alternatives, and so on.

            I mostly agree with your assessment of the Warriors lineup, but I would like to see the Ws experiment further in future games. The fact that Kerr has experimented, somewhat, doesn’t preclude further experimentation, and it’s actually quite important to know what to do if Bogut gets knocked out again, if Dray can’t handle some huge 4, or if the team simply needs more front line depth (Clippers?).

            I’m not as confident as you that Lee will play much tonight. Horford is quite quick for a C, and Lee’s main advantage over traditional Cs is his quickness. It’s possible that Speights’ size and shooting accuracy will prevail over Lee getting many minutes.

            Other than that, I agree. The Ws smalls are better than the Hawks’ smalls. If the Ws can move the game into a small v. small speedball contest, the Ws will win.

      • OK.
        You mentioned SF beer week. A friend was askin me if I was interested. I just told him its always SF beer week for me :)

        • Yeah, but you can access stuff almost impossible to get at other times.

          • just in the burgs of SF, oaktown, and berserkley there are more specialty beer pubs than any one person could possibly survey comprehensively in terms of sampling the diverse offerings. of course the bier fest or week whatever it is will have some items those pubs won’t, but be assured that something quite similar will be found in them. selbstverstaendlich, it’s a convenience for the consumers to have more available in a smaller area in a concentrated time and space allotment during your fest. did you know that the mikkeller folks have a gastropub near the tourist district in SF. there’s a good biergarten type of place on the water in oaktown, with above average pub food, a focus on german brews but inclusive of others, Brotzeit.

          • moto,

            I was at Mikkeller’s mother ship in Copenhagen all the time during my extended stay there. Yes, I did go to the one in the TL–and they just opened one in NYC. I did visit the joint in Oakland you mentioned.

            But some stuff you can get during Beer Week is almost impossible to get hold of at other times.

  6. Wishful thinking Felty. Atlanta
    going to be crushed by Cleveland in
    Western finals if they even make it
    to finals.

    LT, you should make your arguments without
    referring to opposing views as stupid or
    demonstrating ignorance. . I find that you
    don’t know the difference between
    basic concepts as effective field goal percentage
    and field goal percentages,and your insinuating
    that Livingston is not a very good shooter since
    three other Warriors shoot a higher FG percentage
    when, in fact, Livingston has an effective
    FG percentage of 51 percent which damn good for a
    back-up and falsely eaves the impression he’s it a
    Good shooter,,which gives me little reason to think you
    Know what you’re talking about.

    Also, you completely undervalue getting rid of Biedrens
    And Jefferson, and over value the lost trade picks.

    But with that said, I think you have been dead
    on in saying Felty has changed positions without
    acknowledging he is doing so.,

    • Frank,

      I thought we agreed to stop this and yet you continue to obsess about my earlier dismantling of your “arguments.” If it made you feel stupid, that was not my intention. The fact that you continue to address me–twice, and especially after agreeing not to–indicates real insecurities on your part. It’s clear to me that you have no understanding of how to use statistics as applied to basketball. You think you do and that I don’t understand. Fine let’s just leave it at that OK?

      We’re both wrong…

      P.S. Livingston himself will tell you he’s not a good outside shooter, whether your “stats” say otherwise or not.

  7. Blow, winds, and crack your cheeks! rage! blow!
    You cataracts and hurricanoes, spout
    Till you have drench’d our steeples, drown’d the cocks!


    What a day for this game. I assume everyone has the same weather.

    The main thing I want to see is if the offense can get going 1st. Q, and if not, why not. Early starts have been the key to so many games. I’m not clear about Atlanta’s defense, but playing catchup will be hard against this offense.

  8. It’s too early to access Barnes completely and accurately. Still, I think the following are important points about his game (mostly Felt inspired, some my own):

    1. Defends 4’s better than 3’s,
    2. Can drive to the rim on his own against 4’s much better than against Wings.
    3. Can fake and get his shots off better against 4’s.
    4. Is a good support player to the other starters.
    5. Is needed to start with Green for the additional size, strength, and rebounding.
    6. Is an average shooter.
    7. Has proven to perform best as a Stretch-4.
    8. Won’t get traded, because his trade value is not what it was and because he has value to the Warriors and can be signed at a relatively low contract value.

    I got my hard hat on, so bomb away!

    • For me the HB conundrum can be summed up in 6 words:

      He’s simply along for the ride

    • PS I’m not saying that he’s a bad guy. It’s obvious his teammates like him and I always hope for the best when he’s on the floor.
      My brother and his best friend started and built their business over the last 27 yrs. Now I’m along for the ride and thrilled about it.


      Just kidding. It is beyond me why any player should be treated with kid gloves.

      Barnes has in fact, played heavy minutes, most with starters for 2 5/8 seasons, averaging 27 mpg. That’s heavy usage, probably much more than most rookies in his class get.

      I’m sure any GM, Myers included, runs trade scenarios for everyone on the roster (see Thompson, Klay) though several will be taken off the table for obvious reasons (too valuable) or practical ones (untradable). But even if we concede Barnes to be an average player, who would take his place, except the same type player in a trade? Or who would take his place if they traded for a player at another position? I assume there are good reasons we haven’t seen much Rush (I regret this), but he could have filled in at 3. McAdoo was given another 10 day and could fill in at 4, if he’s ready (unlikely), but he’s not a shooter (an acceptable tradeoff for me, given his other strengths). There’s just not anyone else the right size who could fill in for Barnes, not even a player under development on the bench. And that’s why I didn’t think a HB trade was in the cards.

      Man, it’s raining and blowing like a sombitch. Hour to game time. I’m pumped up and spooked.

      • Good point . He’s played enough to make a viable assessment of. I’ve formulated my opinion and no anonymous voice or endless parading of stats will change it. The 39-9 record argument is used way too often to justify arguments of bizarre rationales.
        F’n gotta beat traffic now.

      • suppose barnes sustained a bad concussion or was infected with something, missed three weeks. how much would that hurt the team. suspect it would be minimal ; iguodala (whom he putatively replaced in the starting lineup) going missing would be a worse blow. holiday might surprise a few if he got 12-18 min. per game on a steady basis, and the rest of barnes’ minutes would be absorbed by iguodala, speights, lee, livingston.

        • Long term it would be a stretch filling in, pushing the minutes of Iguodala especially. They need someone there.

          • das Wunderkind’s scholarship and minutes are safe through the end of next season. of course if the team hits a major setback (exposed in the first two rounds of the post season, or losing green to free agency), or the owner gets star struck again chasing a ‘first magnitude’ star [just remember the chatter a mere six months ago about love as one of the top 8-10 players in the entire association], most of the roster becomes expendable ‘for the greater good’.

        • lol
          Watch out for Moto behind the Warriors bench trying to slip HB something in a Gatorade cup.

          Korvers a scary shooter. Now I kind of know how other teams feel when Steph launches. Hope Steph and/or Klay goes supernova second half.

  9. Feltbot, moto, et al.—

    This might sound like a dumb request, but it’s hard to catch everything and I’d like to hear tips on how to watch a game. Too often, it’s not clear everyone has watched the same game (cf. blind men and elephants).

    An aside. We have a significant advantage over national broadcasters and most other national (and many local) media people for a simple reason. We watch most of the games. They do not, but often repeat talking points they’ve been fed. The first thing SVG had all his staff do is sit down and watch tapes of all of Detroit’s games last season. I’d never accuse Kerr and Co. of not doing their homework, but I do wonder how much they watched the past two seasons. What has been hard for us is not see lineups tried we knew worked (my response to Hat’s comment in the last post).

    One thing you have to do is not watch for wins, but possibilities and potential. Most here have been upbeat about the team for years because of these. It is not at all clear, however, the FO has does the same. Otherwise they would have made different roster decisions long ago.

    • my expectations from watching a game are low. fortunately have a nice enough monitor to pay attention to the stuff away from the ball and also catch most of what is happening around the ball. it might be more entertaining just to watch the ball, but limited in educational value. have the radio on for roye’s play by play to alert me to the ball-centric action, seconds ahead of the video.

    • Maybe we can also form a support group to help us cope with Fitz. I’m really dreading this now. I can’t get good radio reception (is it on FM?), but there’s a delay anyway, right?

      • have no idea if the delay on the radio stream is longer than the t.v. broadcast’s — sometimes the radio broadcast is a full possession ahead of the t.v.

  10. Do they play this irritating f’n organ music all game long?

    Kent frigging Bazemore with 3 early 3s.

  11. I agreed not to to go tic for tac
    regarding Iggy not anything else.
    It’s your calling others ignorant
    that made point your your ineptitude.
    Once again, you ignore Livingston’s
    shooting percentage and instead site
    Livingston saying he’s not a good shooter.
    All I know he’s stats are very good
    speak for themselves. But you’re to be
    commended for your writing style. Just
    wish you you added something to the
    discussion. In my humble opinion and
    according to what other’s write, you don’t.
    But I concede you’re a terrific Feltbot

  12. No shame in losing in Atl. They were the better team tonite- players and coaching. Warriors were sloppy with the TOs and Atlanta solid all around. They were impressive, probably shot a bit over their heads, and a lot quicker as a team than I imagined. I’m not ready to crown them champs yet tho.

    Oracle should blast California Love for large parts of the rematch. No excuse for the funhouse music.

    • just remember how Atl put itself in a deeper marketing crisis when that memo from one of the owners (recently bought out) went public about their fuddled public relations. be a while for them to create an identity marketing-wise under the new ownership.

  13. Changed my mind about recapping tonight. Going to rewatch this game and let it burn for awhile.

    But first I’m going to treat the Thaiblonde to some sushi, extra saki.

    If you want to follow my recap closely when it comes, I recommend saving this game tape.

  14. (Atlanta)

    I suppose you could say the Hawks got good shooting from unexpected players—Bazemore!. (Fitz all night.) But that’s not the point. The point is that they have players across the roster, down the bench who can step up. Someone else might have hit. This is a deep offensive team. The Warriors have to hope Iguodala and Barbosa get hot from the outside (and that they can get Barnes open to launch—not often, and he was off tonight). Maybe get Mo going. That’s it.

    I suppose you could say that the Hawks got breaks on fouls (Fitz all night), but that’s not the point either. A team that fast, with that many scorers will challenge defenders. If they don’t get caught reaching in, they simply get blown by or stare at shots. This offense put them on their heels. And the Warriors don’t have enough solid drivers to draw fouls. Yes, many weren’t called. And as St. Jean just said (listening to the recap): Atlanta’s spacing upset the defense.

    I suppose you could say they got bad breaks on careless turnovers, especially at the end of the first half (Kerr just said it), but turnovers were even as were, I believe, points off turnovers.

    The real point, which St. Jean said at the half, the one most relevant for the playoffs, is that Atlanta tried to make Green, Barnes, and Bogut beat them. And they can’t. They stayed in the first half because they got the defensive boards that led to fast breaks—11 fast break points first quarter, I think. But it didn’t work 2nd. half, in part because Atlanta was so hot that there were fewer boards. Green missed his 3s, about all that was open, and struggled to get inside. Barnes got set up on a couple of drives and the fast breaks, but that was it for him. Bogut’s defense was fine first half. If he had any kind of offense, he could have punished the smaller Atlanta—a roll or even a post up—and opened the court up. He doesn’t. So it’s up to Klay and Steph, well covered.

    And come playoffs, they’ll face stiffer defenses and have fewer fast breaks. This starting lineup is not going to work, unless they shift out of it quickly.

    Green had his hands full on defense, but played a man’s game anyway and still muscled in some shots and got all those boards.

    But if you’re going to go small, as they did second half, put one of the best small ball units in the NBA, offense and defense, =/–, on the floor:


    We saw what they could do all last season. This hurts big.

    • I could sum up the above better: Atlanta may not be able to count on shooting that hot, but their spacing and roster depth and versatility put them in a position to score well, and when the offense is flowing, players will step up. The Warrior lineups tonight really put most of the burden on the guards, diminishing their chance to score. And to beat Atlanta when they’re hitting, you have to score.

      • that was so insightful from the shill b-fitz, rationalizing how the Atl reserves’ shot making was a fluke. can’t recognize the SA school of instilling the system and training the shooters.

        • Yeah. And whomever trained Baze in his distance shooting should be hired by the Dubs at any cost to train Iggy! Liv, HB, Draymond, Leandro and Andrew could all sit in on the sessions too.

          Maybe its the homer in me but the Hawks seemed to get a few more calls. Pretty even overall though.

          • Yea, Baze buried his 3’s, 11 points, 5 boards, looked composed and deliberate out there with no turn overs.

          • Atlanta did get breaks on fouls and enjoyed exceptional shooting. But the only way the Warriors beat them is exceptional shooting from Steph and Klay themselves, as has often happened, Dallas, for example. The Warriors need to find a way, like Atlanta, to spread the odds and options all around.

      • Brilliant summary of your earlier thoughts! Keep it coming!

    • Warriors need a 3rd reliable 3-point shooter, preferably at the PG position. I believe a trade will be made at the dead line or will find a guy in the D League.

      • If he could facilitate and direct a fast paced attack too …
        I actually had a dream Monta was still playing for the Dubs. Waking up ruined it.
        I’m equally worried about bogut now. Seriously think we should consider shutting him down until the playoffs. Just let him get as healthy as possible for the playoffs. Maybe even wait to break him back in til 1st rd playoffs if its a nice matchup..

        • bogut’s legs looked gone in the second half, abetted by Atl’s adjustment to test him with horford at the very start of the third period, breaking open a lead. he was also flatfooted in the fourth period vs. Dal. this left green as the sole quality defender inside for most of the half, to which he responded in addition to his usual help on the perimeter, plus going down court with the ball for a solo break. will myers and lacob put off getting help for green (and bogut, the real deficiency) until the season is done.

          • A quick thought on Bogut (“Bogut’s legs looked gone”), he’s looked tired and sluggish since returning from his bout with whatever bug he had, and in fact I heard the other day he was still taking medication in relation to his illness.

    • Maybe at this stage DLee is suited at Center, no longer PF. Something real wrong with his D lately. I mean previously I thought he at least held his own and gave as good as he got. Now he looks completely out of place.

      • That may be more a function of the lineups. Lee has his strengths, but also his limitations. He needs to be surrounded by a full defensive squad. The weak link on offense and defense fourth quarter was Barnes. On D he looked out of place all night and doesn’t offer much versatility on crossmatching or improvising. I suppose if he hit his shots it might have worked out, but in saying that you’re giving a spot in the roster to a passive scorer over one who can create and score on his own. Barnes shouldn’t have closed out the game.

        • Who would have you played in place of Barnes ? Lee was horrible. Barnes atleast can be counted on hitting a 3 . Last game, he scored 12 pts off 5 shots and this game, he was 6-12. Barnes also had some nice drives to the hoop. Barnes was not the worst defender there, Lee was. Even Green was not as good on man to man D though understandable given the load falls on his shoulder without Bogut out there.

  15. Two great offensive systems on
    Display tonight. The Warriors made
    no attempt to defend the three ball
    by the Hawks secondary scorers. As
    such. game over. That won’t happen
    again. Also, our not having players
    who can get to the foul line evident
    tonight. Nor do we have many quick
    players who can make steals.

    We lost on 3 pointers and Hawks going to
    Foul line, while we won FG percentages
    offensive rebound battles.

    But as we went from playing big to
    playing small, the Hawks FG percentage
    went from 37 percent to above 50 percent
    before averaging out at 44 percent. So
    much for small ball against other good
    small ball teams.

  16. Kerr in his after game press conference said the Warriors don’t have as many 3-point shooters as the Hawks and so did Green. Both expressions sounded like hints to me. Kerr said he “tried” to match up. Look for a trade before the dead line.

    • the team p.r. and shills like b-fitz are constantly pointing out how lacob’s Wunderkind barnes is among the assoc. leaders in 3 pt. pct., >.42 and second to thompson on the team. yet rarely does barnes make a winning, decisive impact with that shooting (like stepping up when the team needs a scoring option ; if he were doing so consistently, why would kerr make this comment) ; no doubt he does chip in when the offense is going well. is kerr’s offense failing to get barnes more attempts, or is the player passive and ineffective in getting open within the flow of the offense. or is his gaudy shooting pct. an empty stat in the context of actual play. or, is he falling short in other areas, which pushes kerr into limiting his minutes and role in the offense.

      • Barnes did make a decisive 3 or like yesterday when he drove to basket. In a game where at least 3 players played worse than him, u have to pick on a player who went 6/12, 4/5 last two games. May be they should call his number more often for 3 shot. Not sure there is any team in the league where 3rd best 3 pt shooter shoots at 42%. Your hatred of Barnes is quite obvious.

      • That’s what gets me too. Why would Kerr (and Green) make that comment otherwise? As Harry points out, Barnes % is plenty sufficient for a 3rd 3-point option.

  17. Fun game to watch but given the production from two unlikely sources (Bazemore and Scott btw I watched the Hawks the other night and Bazemore looked like he often did when he played here ie very ordinary, including shooting a 23ft jumper 28ft) and the “human element factor” (pointed out in the “Who will win?” section of ESPN’s 5-on-5 piece ) which all but guarantees a certain number of losses each season for every team (NBA schedule). Fast forward to when these two teams meet for the only other time this season in mid-March @ Oracle, the Warriors will still be enjoying a stretch of 10 out of 12 @ home while Atl will be playing their 5th game of a 6 game road trip. In other words, what happened tonight to GSW will likely happen to the Hawks in the rematch.

    To be honest, I’m not a believer in the Hawks in regards accomplishing anything special (championship) this season. They remind me of the 2007-2008 Houston Rockets who were a very average team for the first 44 games of that season (24-20) then out of nowhere went on a 22 game winning streak (3rd longest in NBA history). When the streak was over they went 9-7 the rest of the way and then were eliminated in 6 games in the first round of the playoffs. My point is that 22 game winning streaks in any sport almost always denotes a form of greatness, but that Rockets team was anything but great. They were very average but somehow went on a magic carpet ride that made NBA history only to come crashing back to Earth and do what average teams do in the playoffs, go home early.

    The Hawks are very well coached but their key players are veteran players who have been around the block a few times with multiple teams. This roster won’t be able to sustain this success for very long, likely also meeting the same demise that those ’07 Rockets met. Another good comparison imo would be the Warriors “We Believe” team, a veteran group that came together via great chemistry and equally great coaching and excited their fans into believing can’t-stop-us-now thoughts until reality hit home early in the postseason, and then REALLY hit home the following season. This is lightning-in-a-bottle stuff that will become apparent soon enough, even playing in the East.

    Compare their success to GSW who has put together a young core through the draft and will likely remain a very strong title contender in the years to come given a modicum of good luck and wise decision making (draft, free agent signings, trades, etc) in the future as older players such as Bogut, Lee, and AI are replaced while the core stays intact (as the Warriors try to emulate the long term success of the Spurs and how they continually tweaked their roster around their “big 3”).

    The Warriors have a chance to be a great team for years to come while the Hawks have a chance to maintain their gaudy won-loss record for a little while longer until ultimately the clock finally strikes midnight.

    • Very nice, Maui. I won’t be surprised to see the Warriors take Atlanta next time around. I also doubt we’ll see Atlanta in the finals. Then again, if Cleveland doesn’t stay together, I don’t know who will be there.

      I just hope the Warriors aren’t like those Rockets themselves. Our own streak wasn’t that significant, either, and it’s still not clear what kind of playoff team they’ll be.

      Streaks make me nervous. So does being on top, unless a team is so good they can’t help winning. I’d hate to see the Warriors break their necks and get conservative on rotations to stay in first place. Better to keep working on weaknesses and figure what their identity really is.

  18. To Felt or anyone still thinking about the Mavs game 2 days ago, I found an article that mentioned a lot of what Feltbot says the Warriors need to fix, specifically the usage of Lee.

  19. David Lee was absolutely horrid on defense last night and the Hawks exploited that and abused him. However good he is on the PnR, the W’s simply cannot have him on the floor that long when he’s playing D so poorly.

    Also, has he regained his outside shot or not? He was horrible last year and lost all confidence in it. I thought in the preseason that he might have regained it but I see no sign of that now as he rarely shoots from distance. Plus, he’d be taking the pick and pop option off the table.

    If Lee cannot/has not regained his outside touch there are serious spacing problems if he plays with Bogut. Indeed, his entire career as an effective player will be in jeopardy if he has lost his touch. He’ll become extremely predictable on offense and his defense–in spite of apparent improvement earlier in the year–will never be good and we can only expect it to deteriorate as he ages. And we haven’t even talked about his injuries. I really hope that he can regain his form as he’s been such a strong teammate and hard worker.

    Draymond is now shooting 32.8% from 3, which is lower than last year. I suspect that fatigue has something to do with this. But I’m convinced he’s a better shooter than last year and will shoot at least as well (33.3%) by the end of the year. He really needs to get up around 35-36% to be a real threat. Part of it might be due to being more indiscriminate with his shots this year. I saw him pass up 2 wide open 3’s last night so I suspect he’s been talked to by the staff.

    Bogut doesn’t have any bounce in his step. Lingering knee problems? Flu? General malaise? Everyone says the team’s toast if they don’t have the Big Aussie for the playoffs but he’ll have to step up his game if he does make it. Also, I think the real issue isn’t whether or not he’ll be available for the 1st day of the playoffs (I think the W’s will do everything in their power to make sure this happens). Rather, the real concern is whether he can remain healthy and productive for a long post-season run. That, I highly doubt.

    • “David Lee was absolutely horrid on defense”

      That is two games in a row. If he is not on a big contract for this year and next year, he could easily find himself out of rotation. Hope he can turn it around, because warriors need his scoring.

    • All valid points Longtimer. Concise too.

      Its odd whats going on with DLee. He was looking better and better since returning bur seems to have run into a brick wall. His D -and impact- were not positive last night. I’m wondering why his minutes have been so limited lately. It can be hard for a scorer like Lee to get into the flow of the game as such.
      Justin’s also gone MIA. Will BRush ever see the court when the minutes actually count. Bogut…!?? Kerrs got a lot of tinkering to do. He does have the luxury of a nice cushion which the team has built. Getting taken out to the woodshed can lead to postive things. I’m still looking at a glass 3/4s full. And we have 3 gimmees comin up. Nice time to take a break from the serious NBA watching in conjunction with the All-Star break..

      After the game last night I watched a movie I would highly recommend to any American sports fan and everyone who posts here. My 15 year old niece, atypical girly teen who hates hoops, watched it too and made some pretty astute observations afterwards. Its called “Big Fan” and its dark but good. Kinda of like looking into the mirror on a bad day.
      Hope we get some more rain.

      • So, you like “concise.” I never would have guessed! Thx for the movie tip; I’ll look for it.

        I don’t think they got “taken out to the woodshed”–it was a pretty close game.

        Last game Kerr said it was bad match ups–and this game I didn’t hear anything, but my strong suspicion is that Lee’s D was so poor that he couldn’t afford to keep him in. I hope that Felt doesn’t get up to the same usual BS in his “report”–i.e. blaming Kerr, the wrong “system,” the “weird” planetary alignment last night, whatever–for his beloved Lee’s obvious failings. (Side note: no, I don”t agree [nor does anyone else in the entire basketball universe] that the entirety of the Warriors’ chances at post season success lies solely with Kerr’s “proper” understanding of how to use David Lee in the PnR (one of his”gems” that he keeps repeating).

        Lee looked a bit surfer-dude stoned last night. He really seemed out of it. Bogut didn’t look terribly engaged either. He seems to run hot and cold quite a lot for someone who’s really mostly engaged in hustle and trench work. Usually such things do not hinge upon being “hot” or “cold” like shooting. Some of it is match ups and some injuries. But at times I wonder if some of it is not a bit psychological. He definitely strikes me as someone who sees basketball as a game and not something that he’s going to risk his health for. This is reasonable but perhaps leads to too much caution on his part.

        Barbosa’s good in fits and starts to generate offense when he’s on. But when he’s not, he can be a real hindrance to the team’s flow and is a liability on defense as well. I’d real like to see Holiday get more burn. Maybe he’s not been practicing well.

        • reread your own ‘psych eval’ speculation about bogut’s mental state or attitude about ‘too much caution’. were you following the team when the partisans speculated about biedrins, how his coach destroyed his confidence und so weiter ? with biedrins, there was possibly an element of burn out, as he had been enrolled into intensive sports training since an early age and turned pro even before the n.b.a., where he began as a high school aged rookie. but with both bogut and biedrins the most basic explanation for tentative play is usually correct — they’re getting very physical signals and pains from body parts that things aren’t right and more harm can result from all out exertion.

          • I wasn’t meaning it as a dig on Bogut. I think that it’s reasonable to be cautious. On the other hand, I suspect that if, say, Draymond or Steph were experiencing the same amount of pain at times when Bogut decided to sit out they, at times, would play. Bogut might be just smarter about things–or overly cautious. But all this is highly speculative and understanding how another human being actually experiences pain is entirely subjective. He’s been very open about the fact that basketball is not the be all and end all for him, so it’s perhaps a bit easier for him to be prudent–even when he injures himself in his sleep! (Still love that kerfluffle!)

            I don’t see the Biedrins case as being analogous (if that’s what you meant my inscrutable Javanese friend).

            I’ve been a W’s fan since 1973. I know why I picked my other favorite sports teams but can’t remember the rationale for the W’s. But they were my favorite among favorites from the beginning. I remember tuning our shortwave radio to just the right micro-millimeter of bandwidth to pick of W’s games on the east coast. And I remember staying up late to watch tape delays of the brutal Western conference finals against the Bulls in 1975. Great match-up that was!

            Bob Love, Chet Walker, Norm Van Lier, Jerry Sloan, Nate Thurmond, Rick Adelman….They were tough!

    • It’s hard to gauge Lee on offense because he hasn’t been featured as a scorer yet and given many shots. We have seen what the midrange can do with Speights, in fact it has bailed the team out on many occasions. But I wonder too about his shot. He didn’t get many shots under Jackson either, but this season and last he looks tentative and often passes the midrange up.He even looks tentative on the free throw line. I do hope Ron Adams has been working with him. He was a consistent shooter before.

      There’s no reason to focus only on Lee on defense exclusively. Everyone has gotten burned the last two games and missed rotations. Really for the first time, the team faced superior coaching and full court schemes, and they haven’t figured out adjustments yet. The many reach in fouls last night by everyone last night are as much cause for concern: it shows players a step behind or out of position.

      Lee’s stints last night were brief and he wasn’t given a chance to settle in. Nor has he played with a consistent lineup or scheme all season, not been given enough time to get adjusted, unlike the starters.

      But we saw what Lee could do with the right lineup last season, as I mentioned above, which, when +/– is weighed, simply works, and it hasn’t been tried yet. It’s just hard to believe he has fallen so far so fast.

      And we keep mentioning Lee because he is the only sizable player who can present an inside/outside threat, who is sharp on the court and provides leadership and stability. I still say success in the postseason depends on Lee.

      And his health.

      • Lee said that he didn’t shoot from distance last year because he felt the team needed him inside. But by mid season he had lost all confidence in it and he was passing up open shots. The previous year he was money from 16′ on in–still a Jackson team, so it wasn’t about MJ not wanting him to shoot. He’ll need that moving forward–as will the W’s. But Lee is most certainly not the most important Warrior in terms of post season success. That’s going way too far.

        Also–and this has been bothering me for some time–what’s all this talk about being disappointed that Kerr’s not experimenting? That’s a load of rubbish (excuse me). He’s been experimenting relentlessly with different lineups and has been quite open about his desire (and rationale) to do so. That’s why you see him change up how he staggers the substitutions all the time and see some players play a lot one game and not the next. In fact, he’s constantly deploying different lineups at different points in the game–and then he and the staff go over them carefully afterwards, I can assure you. Do you not notice this?

        Just because he’s not changing the starting lineup to suit your and Felt’s desires does not mean he’s not experimenting. There’s a simple reason why he doesn’t frequently change the starting lineup: because he wants to lay at least some foundation of continuity and stability. All good coaches do this. Moreover, he worked tirelessly and successfully to assuage Lee and Iguodala’s concerns and he’s not going to back on this and just change up the starting 5 unless he has a very good reason to (e.g. the unit suffers through extended bad play). Plus, he’s been open about his assumption that injuries will play a role and this will (and has) present many natural opportunities to change the starting lineup.

        Kerr’s been very open that he’s not going to change out starting players if the team is playing well–not to mention record pace setting well. No halfway decent coach does this. I strongly suspect that neither you nor Felt has any experience coaching basketball at a sophisticated and high level so this lack of experience might blind the two of you to what are rather obvious factors in running a successful NBA team. I’m not trying to insult you rgg–just point out a possible reason why you’ve been pushing such a nonsensical line so hard and for so long.

        • Well, he’s been experimenting like crazy with the second unit but hasn’t settled on anything so the guys can get used to it. The reason he’s experimenting, of course are Barnes, who is hard to fit into a second unit, and other problems on the bench.

          Maybe the starting unit remains, but the key is how long he sticks with it, especially when it falters, and who closes. I only see indecision fourth quarter.

          But there is no reason in the world not to experiment with the starting unit, and there is the possibility of gain. Kerr himself said it was temporary at the beginning of the season. Nothing would be lost. They have a good lead in the standings, a lot of games to go, and plenty of teams against whom any mistakes can easily be covered. And if experiments don’t work, they, the original starters have a full season of practice. It would be easy to return to square one, without loss.

          • The counter example, of course, is Pops, who will change starting lineups for a variety of reasons, many to adjust to different demands of different teams. Come playoff time, they are ready with many options.

            And if Bogut’s health remains a question, a heavy possibility, they have to experiment to be ready.

          • The playoffs are different and coaches do alter lineups because of the fact that teams need to counter other teams’ tendencies. Pop’s starting lineups change mostly because he’s constantly resting his vets.

            The problems with changing the starting lineup in the regular season on a team that’s doing well are obvious to me and–quite clearly–Kerr as well. I think you’re fetishizing the starting lineup as well; there are plenty of opportunities to see how Lee, say, blends in with most of the starters. Just because it’s not at the beginning of the game doesn’t render it meaningless.

            The 2nd unit’s play has been uneven–quite so in fact. The main reason why you don’t experiment with a starting unit (most especially a highly successful one) is for the exact same reason you presented above explaining the 2nd unit’s failings:

            In your own words:

            “he’s been experimenting like crazy with the second unit but hasn’t settled on anything so the guys can get used to it. “

          • Also obviously, whatever experiments made with the starting lineup would be minor.

            A large part of the success so far has come from getting off to good offensive starts, which has set the course for the rest of the game. If the starters falter scoring, adjustments should be made quickly, which has happened on a few occasions. MJax’s starting lineup often was quite successful. The problem was the second unit blew leads and they had to come back in quickly and key players staggered and played too many minutes.

            I didn’t say this was an easy problem to solve.

          • ‘The reason he’s experimenting, of course are Barnes, who is hard to fit into a second unit, and other problems on the bench.’

            Lol, sure Barnes is the reason for any of warriors problems as you and moto confurms.

        • No, of course Lee isn’t most important. He has the potential, however, to be an important piece who offers options others don’t.

        • I’ll keep going. The truth of the matter is, they could probably use any starting lineup and win as many games. The obvious example here is Speights filling in at starting center, as I said before, who did just fine, though that is as much a reflection of the other players and the coaching.

          That’s the problem with this season. So many games just aren’t giving good information, largely because of inferior opposition or depleted lineups from injury against the better teams. And in many games, they had to depend on brilliant offensive games by Steph and/or Curry, in a few cases even Speights, and in one (Chicago) Green. They can’t count on those performances consistently in the playoffs.

          That’s why the match-ups against teams like Dallas, Atlanta, OKC, Chicago, and Memphis are critical. Cleveland should be interesting now. They are the only teams to provide useful feedback for the playoffs. The returns so far are ambiguous, and a little iffy.

          • You say that it’s not an easy problem to solve while I say that it’s not a problem to be solved in the first place. I don’t understand what the “problem” is with the starting unit who, with Bogut, is 30-3. Why? Because there is no problem. Is it absolutely perfect and without any shortcomings? Of course not. But it isn’t a problem at all–quite the opposite, in fact. Why you and Felt seem to think there’s a problem is absolutely bizarre to me and I’ve yet to hear of any reasonable explanation of why it is a “problem.”

            Also, inserting DLee into the starting five is not a simple and minor tweak as you suggest. It changes the personnel at two positions and would greatly alter the team’s spacing and defensive approach. The whole complexion of the unit would change, in fact.

            A team’s success is based largely on its chemistry, which is forged through getting used to playing with each other. This, in part, explains the W’s current success as well as that of other teams. Everyone knows how important this is except for, apparently, you and Feltbot.

            I’ve heard only two explanations so far and they’re both extraordinarily weak:

            1) “The 2nd unit is not playing up to its potential and, therefore, we need to shake up the starting unit to change this.” You don’t change up a highly successful first unit just to help the less important 2nd unit. The 2nd unit needs more time playing together and some new–and perhaps different–schemes to take advantage of their differing talents and proclivities. This will take time and more experimenting and does not require overhauling the first unit. (Related to this: I suspect that Feltbot was being highly disingenuous when he claimed that the 2nd unit’s offense would improve by replacing Lee with Barnes. He can’t possibly believe this but, as we’ve seen over and over, he’ll throw as much “mud” at the wall as possible and hope some of it sticks.)

            2) The first unit needs to change because it doesn’t natch up well with the likes of Memphis and the Spurs. No unit is perfect but you can make adjustments in the playoffs if necessary. No need to change things up now for all the reasons I gave.

          • FeltbotsFakeGirlfriend

            Warriors 4-0 vs OKC, 2-0 vs Dallas, 1-1 vs Chicago

  20. Draymond Green had *four times* as many rebounds last night as David Lee has had in his last two games *combined.*

    That’s astonishing.

    Guess it’s time for Feltbot to walk back his claim that Draymond is too small to play the 4 on a consistent basis. He was going on and on about this after his one rebound game so I expect him to completely reverse his position after last night’s game.

    • Tonight DLee 10/10 double-double plus 5 assists in 22 minutes. Bogut posted similar numbers 7/7 with 3 assists in 18 minutes. Green 20/13 with 3 assists in 34 minutes.

      • Last two Games Draymond averaged 16.5 rebounds per game.

        I guess Felt’s argument that Draymond can’t hack playing the 4 because of one game where he only had one rebound is a pile of…..
        (fill in the blank). Wouldn’t you say?

        • Green can definitely play the 4 successfully, as he has shown. He is similar to Milsap, except Milsap is about an inch taller and 15 lbs heavier. Milsap plays next to a mobile, scoring center with a taller 4 off the bench who can bury the 4, analogous to DLee playing the 5 alongside Green. Barnes in the capacity of a Stretch-4 off the bench would increase his 3-point productivity with additional opportunities, naturally leading to increased practice. This dovetails into the rgg discussion @ 23 below.

  21. To add. Dubz are 4-0 against houston.

  22. Nix:

    I suspect we saw the script of how Kerr intends to finish the season and enter the playoffs, both in terms of rotations and play. The plodding performance of the subs second half was dismal. They didn’t play into their strengths, but away from them. And didn’t try to push the pace at all.

    So many mismatches to be exploited—a good night for some of the other players to step up. They didn’t.

  23. Longtimer et al.—

    This is a good discussion. The first general principle is that you always explore all options and make your best decisions from the results. This hasn’t been done, but there’s still no reason not to do so. The fast start, their lead, and the weak competition coming give them a chance to experiment without loss. And the veterans are smart and can adapt quickly to anything. Also, if Kerr is being cautious and sticking with what he’s done before simply because it’s familiar and plans to continue doing so for that reason, he may well be setting himself up. As I keep saying, the results, while good, are ambiguous because of the lower level of competition. A handful of games, however, are concerning. More serious tests lie ahead. Always mix things up, always look for advantages. These are principles of competitive survival.

    The advantages to the Lee, Bogut, Iguodala, Klay, and Steph starting lineup is that it offers more offensive facilitators and scoring options, assuming Lee is played to advantage and gets that midrange going. It will allow them to get off to fast starts against the better teams. You’re also putting the most experienced and intelligent players on the floor to start the game. You won’t have to depend on Barnes’ getting open on occasion or Green popping 3s.

    This lineup will offset another liability, Bogut’s limited to nonexistent offense. Kerr did try to get Bogut involved more early, with some success, but we’re not seeing it all now. If Bogut could play last night, he couldn’t have gotten some practice in against Amundson, rolling to the hoop or just posting up?

    On defense, there is a loss. Green is an incredibly versatile defender, and that will be lost. More and more, I suspect, he’s compensating for Bogut’s limited mobility, and doing so better than Lee. But that loss will be offset by the addition of Iguodala, a great, versatile defender himself. Lee is a proven rebounder, and can muscle up against many bigs. And I can’t believe Ron Adams can’t find a better way to play them than MJax.

    There’s another way to look at Green. We could use the same argument of putting him in with the subs that is given for Lee, that he will strengthen them. He could easily be 6th. man of the year. He is much more versatile then Lee with his defense, his ability to play anywhere and anyone, plus there’s his improved offense and good playmaking abilities. He could allow better use of Speights, for example. As it is now, Lee and Speights are cutting into each other’s offense, with a loss. He can offset other defensive issues in that lineup, notably Speights. He can facilitate and push the pace. He can help offset the liability of Livingston’s plodding playmaking. He can allow putting Barbosa on the floor, and/or Holiday (what’s happened to him?), giving yet more scoring options.

    But also he will be playing with starters. Come playoff time, they will get more minutes, and they will be staggered with the subs. Any combination of Klay, Steph, or Iguodala with those players will only make them better.

    Green is not superman, though at times he is close. He is not indefatigable, however, and his energy needs to be preserved to the max where it most counts. For what? Making the subs a solid unit, but more importantly helping the team go small at any position when the opportunity presents itself. Most importantly, keeping him fresh to close out games, when the pressure will be intense. He will get his 30+ minutes and make significant impact.

    What I’m doing is marginalizing the weak links in the roster, Livingston’s limited PG and scoring abilities and Barnes’ passive, limited offense and limited playmaking abilities. At best, he is average defender, but that’s being charitable. Both will simply fill in when possible to spare minutes for others.

    But here’s my problem. I think the evidence from the past is good, that I make a good case. But I will never be able to show you evidence because, by all appearances, the above will not be tried and they will stay the course.


    Set your standards so we can evaluate. What results do you expect come playoff time?

    This is an academic exercise, of course, but it’s kind of fun and gives us something to talk about.

  24. Bruce Jenkins in the Sunday Chron:

    “Tuning into the W’s-Hawks game Fri. nite, it was diffcult listening from home to the Hawks stadium organist. Can you imagine being there? How is it possible that somebody hasn’t barged into the booth and strangled him? Straight from the ranks of Amatuer Hour Hacks, this guy is likely to play anything, sloppily and completely out of context, with the game in progress. I was shocked he didn’t venture into “Sweet Home Uzbekistan.”

    Theres also an article summing up the Murrieta Falls hike in Del Valle Park. If youre going on 50 its a nice workout and you’ll break a serious sweat. Get there early cause its long and bring water and food. The falls are in season according to the article, but i’ve done this one and in my humble opinion its about the journey as much as the destination.

    An interesting urban hike is the loop on the hill that overlooks Candlestick Park. Park on Key St. and follow the trail. The Darwinism of urban plant life is in full effect and there are nice views to boot. Do it at nite if you dare..

  25. Most posters said they would rather have
    Schroeder as the Warriors back-up PG,
    and Felty wants Augsutin instead of
    Livingston. Offense and defensive stats
    just don’t back that up. AS Livingston
    shoots and eff. FG percentage of 51 per
    cent last time I looked, and Schroeder
    an eff. FG percentage of 47 percent and
    Augustin 46 percent. And Agustin who shoots
    a decent percentage shooting three’s makes
    less than one per game.

    Defensively, there’s also a wide gap. As
    Livingston limits PG to shooting 43 percent
    from the field, Schroeder 46 pecent, and
    Augustin a whopping 50 percent.

    Just seems that defense is simply not
    figured into poster’s views, and that the
    three point shot is overly considered and
    doesn’t deserve such consideration.

    Nice going Warriors brass. You got the
    right back up point guard who can defend
    other positions. Ignore Felty and posters
    who argue otherwise.